[Lotus]

I'm glad I know now, I just thought you where a fan of the little rascals!

[Samantha Rogers]

I'm glad I know now, I just thought you where a fan of the little rascals!

I always thought Alfafa was cute!

[Lotus]

While reviewing Isabelle's Long time Hops thread I came across this post!, which btw, if you ever wanted to increase your NBE IQ, just read her thread!

So I don't need to increase my anti-androgen. The question is whether I'm not taking too much. I found this long thread about the benefits of DHT. Most of it is worth reading, too:
http://www.afboard.com/forum/showthread....our-friend

The first post is an article by Pat Arnold -Patrick Arnold is an American organic chemist known for introducing androstenedione-
http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Arnold

Anyways it talks about DHT, other posts by Mister X are very informative and talks about other supplements.

[Samantha Rogers]

While reviewing Isabelle's Long time Hops thread I came across this post!, which btw, if you ever wanted to increase your NBE IQ, just read her thread!

Actually, digging back through the old threads on this massive site is a very humbling experience. There is so much accumulated wisdom in these threads. I do wish the search engine allowed for more specific results, but overall the volume alone is incredible. There are totally amazing stories and advice buried here.

[Lotus]

Actually, digging back through the old threads on this massive site is a very humbling experience. There is so much accumulated wisdom in these threads. I do wish the search engine allowed for more specific results, but overall the volume alone is incredible. There are totally amazing stories and advice buried here.

So true Obi-wan Kenobi, .....I fall asleep at night reading old posts with my version of scotch (ambien) and wake up the next morning still logged in!, I know, boring!

[Lisa Lou]

WOW! I am humbled and awed by the research abilities and scientific knowledge you show Lotus and Jacp. Thank you for the great information! I would be lying if I didn't say I am somewhat overwhelmed, but slogging through the best I can! Every time I read something a new question comes up! As an Engineer Colonel said to me years ago, "Captain, you're pretty smart for a fellow who majored in business."

Thanks to both of you for providing the information you do. If either of you want a subject for a project, I'm game if you think it will help the girls grow. Just sayin'!

Thanks again,
Lisa

[Lotus]

Thanks LL, ha!, my C.O. was a complete nut job!.....I don't think he ever slept!

I've recently have been looking into the shaping of breasts, or Morphogenesis of Mammary glands (shaping of the breasts). Activation of ER-α causes elongation or horizontal growth of mammary duct cells.

Progesterone receptor activation causes side-branching of mammary gland cells.
Density, areolar gland development, and gland lactation development are caused by prolactin receptor activation.

Hops
From the table the effects of 8-prenylnaringenin on estrogen receptors are shown. 8-prenylnaringenin directly stimulates ER-α and the progesterone receptor in the mammary glands. It also indirectly stimulates the prolactin receptor by causing an increase in prolactin. 8-prenylnaringenin (hops) stimulates the hormone receptors responsible for breast growth possibly in elongation, area, areola and density.


I love what hops can do but its not easy to supplement with, at least for me!, imo.


Mammary gland development requires both systemic hormones and local growth factor-mediated tissue interactions. Classical hormone ablation/replacement experiments, and more-recent genetic analyses in mice, have shown that post-pubertal gland development requires systemic hormones from ovary [estrogen (E) and progesterone (P)], pituitary [growth hormone (GH) and prolactin (PRL)] and adrenal gland (glucocorticoids) (Topper and Freeman, 1980). Loss of ovarian or pituitary function leads to failure of hormone-dependent ductal elongation after puberty, with E and GH participating primarily in ductal elongation and P and PRL participating primarily in alveolar development. Glucocorticoids enhance (but are not essential for) ductal elongation and are required for alveolar function in lactation.
http://dev.biologists.org/content/136/9/1423.full


So my question was how does the breast take shape?, and this is what I found, fascinating!

[Samantha Rogers]

Yes, very intetesting. I am leaning more and more to the belief that we need PG as well as PM.
On another note, I today received my little Chinese pills containg Peony and Licorice. They are small, round, hard black pills. 200 in a container. The side bar says a serving is eight and that a serving contains 1320 mg, but it does not give amounts of each ingredient, but rather simply states the ingredients as Paeoni lactiflora (peony root) and Glyeyrrhiza uralensis (licorice)...sheesh!
It recommends 8 pills x 3 times a day. But I have no idea what the Chinese who created this product had in mind as a goal.
However, as I have today restarted my program, and being the adventurous moron that I am, I gallantly popped three of them immediately. Tee hee hee
Thoughts? Anyone?

[Lotus]

Sammie and Lisa,

I think it makes sense to make another post about aromatase!, for those not familiar-

Aromatase is an enzyme, which converts the hormone androgen into estrogenes in a woman's body. Aromatase also converts excess testesterone in a male's body to estrogens.


AROMATASE BOOSTERS
Foods such as tofu, soybeans, soy protein isolate, soybean oil, corn oil and alcohol boost aromatase and should be avoided if you are taking aromatase inhibitors advices FoodForBreastCancer.com. Avoid these foods if you are a bodybuilder taking anabolic steroids or if you suffer from gynecomastia. Aromatase converts excess testosterone from steroid use into estrogens.
http://www.livestrong.com/article/445623...aromatase/


Increasing your testosterone results in aromatase working to convert some of that testosterone to estrogen, which in turn will shut off some of the testosterone effects. Aromatase is primarily concentrated in the skin, especially over adipose, in the scrotum, and around the nipples. Excess fat cells can contribute to an increased amount of aromatase, and nutrient deficiencies can also produce higher levels. Inhibiting the production and function of aromatase will preserve and stimulate more testosterone induced activity (which is what most lifters want).------ Not for NBE Bio-males
http://prohormonedb.com/content.asp?t=What+is%3A+Aromatase+and+Aromatase+Inhibitors&c=6

We have to be mindful of too much though!

Some common causes of increase aromatase activity:
Aging
Zinc deficiency
Obesity
Carbohydrate intolerance and insulin sensitivity
Overuse of alcohol
Liver function changes
Prescription drug side effects, especially diuretics and liver activity drugs



Aromatase inhibitors are also beginning to be prescribed to men on testosterone replacement therapy as a way to keep estrogen levels from spiking once doses of testosterone are introduced to their systems.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aromatase

So a solid cycle could look like:
1 estrogenic herb
1 pro-hormone
1 pro-aromatase
1 potentiator (vitamins/minerals, etc)
pro-aromatase herb (peony root, or liquorice tea), and paba or grapefruit extract to slow the breakdown of the extra hormones you'll have circulating and it should help you out.

The last part we were talking about nettle root!

[Lisa Lou]

Thanks for the update on that LA and JACP. Actually, it was a slow day at work and I looked up a few things that I have read in the Forum the last several days. Here is a link on an aromatase inhibitor I found:
http://www.seacoast.com/prostol/nature-s...-caps/p102
This is one of many, so by no means an endorsement, I just thought it was interesting having the nettle root and SP together.
Thoughts?

Also, I know this is the aromtase thread, but here are a couple more:

DIM - http://www.cancer.gov/drugdictionary?cdrid=462587 seems to have properties that "promote beneficial estrogen metabolism."
Thoughts on adding this to the cocktail?

Finally, drum roll please.... My fav.....

http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/archi...-2177.html

HOPS!!! Okay, ladies, Run, don't walk to your nearest stop and rob and pick up as much IPA as you can carry! (Hops makes the bitterness in IPAs, it is the beer with the highest hops content)
NOW we know why all those frat boys in college had moobs!

If your SO or someone asks why you are being such a Conehead and consuming mass quantities, tell them it is purely for medicinal purposes! (who remembers John Belushi, Jane Curtain and Dan Ackroyd??? Man, we're OLD!)

Okay, LA and JACP, I know you are conspiring to make me into a mad herb scientist, but it ain't in the cards... However, I can research like a mutha#&%@*$ . What are your thoughts on adding some variation of each of these to the mix. From what I can tell, along with PM, they should satisfy the 4 requirements in the straw cocktail that JACP outlined... Okay, I have this sudden urge to go purchase a pocket protector See ya!

LL