Hops as possible alternative to PM

#21

Update.  About 1 week on the following: started with one 10 mg Swanson 8PN, upped to 2 pills, 12 hours apart, and the last 2 days, 3 pills 8 hours apart.  Six to eight Fennel oil drops on chest every day during the last week.  Brain fog has diminished and is not an issue.  Still slight headache, right temple, for a few hours after taking a pill. Gas issue has lessen over time and may have stopped. Still taking probiotic which may be helping.  Feeling hungry and a shot of protein helps.  No physical changes in measurements.  Breasts have a slight aching feeling sometimes.  While lying face down during a massage yesterday, I felt my breasts were under some pressure; this feeling has not happened before.  This morning, more slight ache in breasts.  Nipples seem to be a little more sensitive.  Past blood pressure issues seem to have diminished.  Not sure, but the 8PN may have lowered my BP or make it more controllable with my other BP meds.  On several occasions, my BP dropped too low and I took a few drops of red clover (known to me to increase my BP) to boost it.  My sleep has improved.  I fall asleep faster and wake up in the morning feeling more refreshed than before the 8PN pills.  I sleep fewer hours at night without feeling like I am sleep deprived. For me, this may be a good reason to continue with the hops pills whether or not I have any other benefits.

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#22

(03-07-2021, 03:10 PM)thegirl1951 Wrote:  

Update.  About 1 week on the following: started with one 10 mg Swanson 8PN, upped to 2 pills, 12 hours apart, and the last 2 days, 3 pills 8 hours apart.  Six to eight Fennel oil drops on chest every day during the last week.  Brain fog has diminished and is not an issue.  Still slight headache, right temple, for a few hours after taking a pill. Gas issue has lessen over time and may have stopped. Still taking probiotic which may be helping.  Feeling hungry and a shot of protein helps.  No physical changes in measurements.  Breasts have a slight aching feeling sometimes.  While lying face down during a massage yesterday, I felt my breasts were under some pressure; this feeling has not happened before.  This morning, more slight ache in breasts.  Nipples seem to be a little more sensitive.  Past blood pressure issues seem to have diminished.  Not sure, but the 8PN may have lowered my BP or make it more controllable with my other BP meds.  On several occasions, my BP dropped too low and I took a few drops of red clover (known to me to increase my BP) to boost it.  My sleep has improved.  I fall asleep faster and wake up in the morning feeling more refreshed than before the 8PN pills.  I sleep fewer hours at night without feeling like I am sleep deprived. For me, this may be a good reason to continue with the hops pills whether or not I have any other benefits. Starting to have major wood events that have not happened for a long time.

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#23

(03-07-2021, 03:14 PM)thegirl1951 Wrote:  
(03-07-2021, 03:10 PM)thegirl1951 Wrote:  

Update.  About 1 week on the following: started with one 10 mg Swanson 8PN, upped to 2 pills, 12 hours apart, and the last 2 days, 3 pills 8 hours apart.  Six to eight Fennel oil drops on chest every day during the last week.  Brain fog has diminished and is not an issue.  Still slight headache, right temple, for a few hours after taking a pill. Gas issue has lessen over time and may have stopped. Still taking probiotic which may be helping.  Feeling hungry and a shot of protein helps.  No physical changes in measurements.  Breasts have a slight aching feeling sometimes.  While lying face down during a massage yesterday, I felt my breasts were under some pressure; this feeling has not happened before.  This morning, more slight ache in breasts.  Nipples seem to be a little more sensitive.  Past blood pressure issues seem to have diminished.  Not sure, but the 8PN may have lowered my BP or make it more controllable with my other BP meds.  On several occasions, my BP dropped too low and I took a few drops of red clover (known to me to increase my BP) to boost it.  My sleep has improved.  I fall asleep faster and wake up in the morning feeling more refreshed than before the 8PN pills.  I sleep fewer hours at night without feeling like I am sleep deprived. For me, this may be a good reason to continue with the hops pills whether or not I have any other benefits. Starting to have major wood events that have not happened for a long time.

Very thorough I must admit.  But early days,  never expect instant results or expect to go through the expected route because we are all different except for in one area. We are fascinated and obsessed with how we may be able to control our body and make it ours. Wood event?  Never happened for me, quite the opposite but that doesnt mean you aren't doing it right, you seem to be in control and am convinced you will achieve your goal responsibly. But never forget, it's not just about breasts, there is so much more going on. I don't know what 8PN is so cannot comment there.
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#24

From web search:

Therapeutic Perspectives of 8-Prenylnaringenin, a Potent Phytoestrogen from Hops


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6017581/#

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/bio...naringenin

https://www.verywellhealth.com/the-healt...hops-89058

https://worldwidescience.org/topicpages/...genin.html


From one research paper: "HE (hop extract) remarkably reduced all the 3 lipids, without affecting the HDL level, leading to a decreased LDL/HDL ratio." Point of this is LDL (bad cholesterol) level is reduced. Good for heart health. Another big surprise: had another morning wood today. Maybe the hops approach would be of interest to those in the "Males staying male" group?
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#25

Update: 10 days on 8PN.  2 days ago I started to have minor leg cramps. Last night the leg cramps got worst.  The only thing that I have been taking that could cause this is probably the 8PN.  8PN is believed to have some statin-like qualities to lower cholesterol. In the past, I react to statins, prescribed by my doctor, with leg cramps.  Is there a connection?  Maybe?  Anyway, I have decided to stop the 8PN for now, but maybe try taking it on a intermittent basis in the future: a couple of days on and then a couple of days off.  Also, the brain fog had come back and it was difficult to concentrate; a negative in my opinion.

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#26

Update:  I have been off the 8PN for 3 days.  I think I have had "withdrawal" symptoms from stopping the 8PN.  The first complete day off I did not feel very well, sorta like flu symptoms, headache, tired, etc.  Second day I felt worst, something like what happens when you stop taking a pain killer like oxycodone (I have a bone spur in my shoulder that the doctor prescribed oxycodone for the pain). Today, 3rd day, I felt better, but then around 10 AM I had the feelings of low blood sugar (no need to list them here, look up the symptoms).  I took a blood sugar measurement and found that for no reason, other than the withdrawal possibility from 8PN, my blood sugar was about 30 points lower than my normal. I have never had low blood sugar levels in my life.  I took some food and felt better.  Also, I checked my blood pressure and it was low by about 10-15 points from my normal.  I mention my reaction to the 8PN and the sudden stopping of the herb as a caution to others who may want to use the herb.  In hindsight, maybe I should have tapered my stopping the herb.

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#27

My new regimen uses is built with Hops as my main source of estrogen(mimics estradiol). I dont use Swansons since there is literally zero point. 1. Estro8pn is already made by your body in the gut and colon by the microbiome and 2. Swansons is a waste of money since you can get a higher concentration of estro8pn from normal hop supplements.

Im taking 2 hop flower supplements(620mg each) 2 times a day. Since hops are 70 fold less potent than estradiol, taking 2.4 grams a day is more than enough 8pn to have effects on the body.
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#28

(24-01-2023, 09:12 PM)NuqueNilex Wrote:  My new regimen uses is built with Hops as my main source of estrogen(mimics estradiol). I dont use Swansons since there is literally zero point. 1. Estro8pn is already made by your body in the gut and colon by the microbiome and 2. Swansons is a waste of money since you can get a higher concentration of estro8pn from normal hop supplements.

Im taking 2 hop flower supplements(620mg each) 2 times a day. Since hops are 70 fold less potent than estradiol, taking 2.4 grams a day is more than enough 8pn to have effects on the body.

Thank you for the input. I currently take Swanson 8-pn, but will try your way with hops.
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