[Owena]

ElainMoria:
*hugs to you too, ElainMoria!* Thanks for your sensitive follow-up. Actually, I didn't take it in a bad way. No worries there! It came through that you were only being concerned and I appreciate that. Also, thanks for the elaboration. The lungs are scary. We have to be careful in what we do to ourselves, don't we? My experiment was really driven by my enthusiasm in this quest. Must now slap myself on the wrist for being impatient, the newbie that I am. LOL

lovely11:
Thanks for your input, too! This is all very educational for me and I heed your warning.

[Dynseli]

Don't feel bad.

[Lotus]

Lotus:
Yes, sublingual delivery would be totally effective in terms of absorption--no need for me to experiment with inhaling. However, my thinking was that instead of an all-at-once dose, inhaling over a day would keep a constant level in the bloodstream. Thanks for your other points and about skin application using coconut oil. I have been using PM tincture mixed with flaxseed oil for skin application. Do you think that is a good carrier (after a good shake)?

Owena, flaxseed has some anti-cancer properties, but for NBE coconut oil is a much better option, and I explain below. In mothers milk, (which coconut oil is simalar too, is high in anti-oxidants.

Consider coconut oil,


Coconut oil-makes connective tissues stronger for that much desired softness and elasticity. superb antioxidant activities that neutralize free radicals and slowing down aging, aids in breast feeding, Coconut oil is nature's richest source of MCFAs."

______________________________________

Coconut oil is a 5 alpha reductase-which means it blocks the most potent androgen DHT (dihydrotestosterone) from testosterone

And according to the study below, Lauric Acid, which coconut oil has @ 50%, it's effect is inhibition in the epithelium and stroma as follows: 51% and 42% (lauric acid)

___________________________________________________

Why Coconut Oil Is So Good For Pregnant & Nursing Mothers
http://www.modernmom.com/c3443748-3b35-1...4a41e.html

Coconut oil contains large amounts of lauric acid, a powerful anti-microbial fatty acid that protects the immune system of the fetus and newborn. Pregnant and nursing mothers should eat coconut oil to increase the quality of the womb environment and breast milk” - Dr. Claudia Pillow

healthy diet contains mixtures of saturated, monounsaturated and polyunsaturated fats. The unique composition of human breast milk contains about 45 to 50 % saturated fat, about 35% unsaturated and 15-20%polyunsaturated. Lauric acid and capric acid comprise about 20% of total saturated fatty acids found in breast milk. Lauric and capric acid have potent antiviral, antibacterial, and parasiticidal (kills parasites) properties that support the immune system. These fatty acids offer the nursing infant protection from illnesses, viruses such as herpes and HIV, protozoa such as giardia lamblia, and bacteria such as chlamydia and heliocobater.

Coconut oil is high in saturated fat (but not cholesterol since it is from a plant) containing about 50% lauric acid. Other components of coconut oil include capric acid, caprylic acid, tocopherols and tocotrienols. (Vitamin E lipids that act as potent anti-oxidants that can help maintain healthy cell structure and function). A study published in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition has shown that lactating mothers who eat coconut oil and other coconut products, have significantly increased levels of lauric acid and capric acid in their breast milk, creating milk rich in health promoting nutrients. Coconut oil is easy for an infant’s immature digestive system to absorb and utilize. It also provides energy in the form of medium chain fatty acids to help the baby grow and develop properly.



IDS 89 and its subfractions on 5 alpha-reductase activity in human benign prostatic hyperplasia.

Abstract
Extract from fruit of Sabal serrulata are used in the treatment of human benign prostate hyperplasia (BPH). Therefore, it is of interest whether this phytopharmacon has any influence on the androgen metabolism in the human prostate. It was found that the extract IDS 89 of Sabal serrulata inhibited dose dependently 5 alpha-reductase activity in the epithelium and stroma of human BPH, the mean inhibition being 29% and 45%, respectively. This inhibitory effect is mainly due to the saponifiable subfraction of IDS 89 showing a mean 5 alpha-reductase inhibition of 39% and 38% in epithelium and stroma, respectively. The inhibition was dose dependent and noncompetitive. At a testosterone concentration of 580 nM as substrate for 5 alpha-reductase, the main fatty acids of the extract IDS 89 gave rise to a percentual enzyme inhibition in the epithelium and stroma as follows: 51% and 42% (lauric acid), 5% and 0% (oleic acid), 43% and 34% (myristic acid), 2% and 0% (palmitic acid), respectively. The inhibitory effect of lauric acid was noncompetitive and dose dependent up to a concentration of 0.2 nM, the maximal inhibition in the epithelium and stroma being 52% and 45%, respectively. The nonsaponifiable subfraction, consisting mainly of phytosterols, showed a mean inhibition of 5 alpha-reductase in the epithelium and stroma of 15% and 10%, respectively. Finally, the hydrophilic subfraction, containing carbohydrates, amino acids, and polysaccharides, showed no inhibitory effect. The present in vitro studies suggest that the Sabal serrulata extract IDS 89 has an inhibitory effect on 5 alpha-reductase in the epithelium and stroma of human BPH. This inhibition is mainly due to the fatty acids of the saponifiable subfraction.

The unique composition of human breast milk fat includes the fatty acids, lauric acid and capric acid, which have potent antimicrobial properties. These fatty acids offer the nursing infant protection from viruses such as herpes and HIV, protozoa such as giardia lamblia, and bacteria such as chlamydia and heliocobater.

Any lauric acid and capric acid in the diet becomes part of the adipose stores.

So taking along with a prolactin inducing herb such as Alfalfa/Fenugreek, coconut when taken internally will increase lauric acid reserves which then become apart of the fat tissues in the breasts which enlarges them... so adding coconut oil would be helpful, no telling by how much though

Thank you for taking the time to show some references.
There is that one study from 2004 which seems to be getting passed around which supports the idea that PM extracts at 1microg/ml cause proliferation of existing MCF-7 cells, and then at higher concentrations, PM extracts kill those same cancer cells (if I am reading the results correctly). Lotus? In any case, the study in question is only looking at existing cancer situations. The summary page I reference below points out that some of these observed effects do not properly control for variables. For example, these effects appear to be possibly more related to how the extracts are created "(ethanolic extract twice filtered, then extracted with hexane and ethyl acetate)" than to any compound present in the root, according to their evaluation.
I don't imagine there are many people in this sub-forum with existing breast cancer, or taking really low quantities of PM. If you have breast cancer and are taking estrogen or estrogen-like compounds, you will most likely demonstrate the concept of survival of the fittest.
I found http://examine.com/supplements/Pueraria+mirifica/ to be a pretty good summary of PM and its benefits and risks and I thought it had a fairly clear summary of the cancer-related studies.
I do suspect that vaping PM is probably taking some unguessable and seriously unnecessary risks.

I've posted this paper too, MCF-7 cancer cells were established in 1968, and the cell line is ER-a postive, which estrogen receptor alpha is the main underlying start of breast cancers. Estrogen receptor beta cancers is established in other tissues, but over stimulation of ER-a comes with risk, I believe the 04' states similar concerns with the 06' study, I think it's worth being hyper-vigilant against ER-a overstimulation. Let's face it,



Phytoestrogens are plant-derived chemicals that have oestrogenic activity, combining with oestrogen receptors and initiating oestrogen-dependent transcription (Kuiper et al. 1998). Their affinities for the oestrogen receptor, however, are at least 1000–10 000 times lower than that of oestradiol and this is an important factor when considering dietary intake of these chemicals and their subsequent circulating concentrations.

The following paper is from 2006, I've only listed a paragraph, but it's the meat and potatoes for our NBE awareness, yes it's technical, but have a look, I'd be happy to review it with anybody concerned.

Phytoestrogens and breast cancer – promoters or protectors?
http://erc.endocrinology-journals.org/co...5.full.pdf

Everyone should read this about Genistein, (one of phytoestrogens in PM and other products).

Also note that increased consumption of soy products reduces plasma concentrations of estradiol.

Genistein: does it prevent or promote breast cancer?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles...9-0057.pdf

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles...85/?page=1

From pg. 702 Possible Anti-Estrogenic Effects of Genistein

Genistein has significant estrogenic properties in both in vitro and in vivomodels (Table1). Genistein binds to the estrogen receptor(ER), although its binding affinity is several-fold weaker than that of estradiol(30). Genistein can also activate a number of estrogen-responsive genes in vitro, including pS2 and c-fos (18,31). Furthermore, when administered at low doses, genistein stimulates the growth of ER-positive(ER+) breast cancer cells (18-20). Findings in other tissue systems support the estrogenicity of genistein. For example, genistein is uterotrophic in a variety of species, resulting in impaired reproductive activity and increases inuterine wet weights.



Phytoestrogens and diseases of the prostate gland.
In particular, soya contains the isoflavone genistein, a compound with many properties which could influence both endocrine and growth factor signalling pathways.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term...98)80008-6

we're taking proactive steps at BN towards current research, here's an important link regarding PM. In English it might explain part of a response (growth) issue seen in genetic males. It's that gate-keeper thing (light switch) called HSD (Hydroxysteroid dehydrogenases) it's an enzyme that's positioned in-between cellular steroid hormones pathways, like E1 to E2. But science also defines them as reductase pathways.


Biological Evaluation of Deoxymiroestrol, a Potent Phytoestrogen from Pueraria candollei var. mirifica

Udomsuk L1, Putalun W1, Juengwatanatrakul T2, Jarukamjorn K1*

Introduction: Deoxymiroestrol is a phytoestrogen isolated from tuberous roots of Pueraria candollei var. mirifica (Leguminosae). Since deoxymiroestrol showed strong estrogenic-like activitiy, it is worth to investigate its biological activity on enzymes related drug metabolism, cytochrome P450s (P450), and sex hormone synthesis pathway, as well as its anti-lipid peroxidation in both in vitro in primary mouse hepatocytes and in vivo in mouse liver. Methods: P450 activities were evaluated in both primary mouse hepatocytes and mouse liver. Expression of CYP1A1, CYP1A2, CYP1B1, CYP2B9, AhR, and ARNT mRNAs were quantified by real- time RT-PCR while their activities were assessed by benzyloxyresorufin and methoxyresorufin O-dealkylation, respectively. Enzymes involved in sex-hormone synthesis pathway in male testes were semi-quantified by RT-PCR. Lipid peroxidation was measured in mouse brain. Results: In primary hepatocytes, expression of AhR, ARNT, and CYP1A1 mRNAs was suppressed whereas that of CYP1B1 was induced by deoxymiroestrol, in which the gene expressions were time- and concentration-dependent patterns compared to those of estradiol. In vivo in mice, deoxymiroestrol enlarged female uterus-weight and -volume as comparable to estradiol. As estradiol did, deoxymiroestrol induced expression of CYP2B9 mRNA whereas those of CYP1A2 were suppressed. Assessment of testicular enzymes involved in sex hormone synthesis pathway showed suppression of 3β-HSD, 17β-HSD1, and CYP17 expressions with those of CYP19 mRNA was slightly decreased by deoxymiroestrol. In addition, the expression of 17β-HSD2 was increased resulting in decreasing estradiol synthesis as that noted by estradiol. In addition, deoxymiroestrol possessed anti-lipid peroxidative activity in mouse brain. Conclusion: These observations suggested deoxymiroestrol as a potential alternative medicine for estradiol according to its distinctive abilities on regulation of related hepatic P450 enzymes and sex hormone-synthesis responsive enzymes, with its beneficent anti-oxidative potential.

http://pharm.kku.ac.th/isan-journal/jour...es_249.pdf

Ok, I think we're seeing a problem here with the down regulation of Hydroxysteroid dehydrogenases (HSDs). In paticlaur 3β-HSD, 17β-HSD1, and 17β-HSD1 catalyzes the activation of estrone (E1) to the most potent estrogen estradiol (E2), predominantly considered as an ezyme of estradiol biosynthesis. Which deoxymiroestrol seems to suppress the action, in other words in males it may interrupt the synthesis of E1 (estrone) to E2 (estradiol).

Which this theory or hypothesis lines up with PM an E1 mediator. Which Dr. Gordon commented on here, albeit from E3 to E1:

Dr Gordon: First, I have to give credit for this information to Dr. Youssef Mirhom, professor emeritus, pharmacognosist and chief scientific officer at Bio-Botanica. Estriol itself is not a hormone secreted by the ovary, but a deactivation product of estrone and estradiol in the human liver by 16-alpha-hydroxylation. Miroestrol is a phytoestrogen (a plant estrogen), and has the same chemical properties, as well as physiological properties as estriol; however, it has a weaker estrogenic effect. And Professor Sayan Sawatsri M.D., gets the credit for the following valuable bit of information—miroestrol has about 3,000 times the estrogenic activity of soy isoflavones. initially said.

Assessment of testicular enzymes involved in sex hormone synthesis pathway showed suppression of 3β-HSD, 17β-HSD1, and CYP17 expressions with those of CYP19 mRNA was slightly decreased by deoxymiroestrol. In addition, the expression of 17β-HSD2 was increased resulting in decreasing estradiol synthesis as that noted by estradiol


17β-HSD type1: 17β-HSD1 catalyzes the activation of estrone (E1) to the most potent estrogen estradiol (E2), predominantly considered as an ezyme of estradiol biosynthesis.

_________________

Hydrohysteroid Dehydrogenases –
Biological Role and Clinical Importance – Review

http://cdn.intechopen.com/pdfs-wm/40961.pdf

[Owena]

Thanks, Lotus, for supplying all that information! Mixed with my tincture, I was assuming topical application, but were you thinking oral?

Also, since coconut oil solidifies at room temperature, I'll have to figure out a way to combine it. Any ideas? Sorry for all the questions! One thing leads to another...

[Lotus]

Thanks, Lotus, for supplying all that information! Mixed with my tincture, I was assuming topical application, but were you thinking oral?

Also, since coconut oil solidifies at room temperature, I'll have to figure out a way to combine it. Any ideas? Sorry for all the questions! One thing leads to another...

No problem, organic is the way to go, here's an article that explains it better than I could.


Coconut Oil: Why it is Good For You

coconut oil is solid at temperatures under 76 degrees F. So if you live at temperatures of 76 degrees F or more, coconut oil is liquid; if less than 76 degrees F, coconut oil is a fat. - See more at: http://coconutoil.com/litalee/#sthash.SWk5SeoS.dpuf

[Owena]

Thanks, Lotus. I picked up a jar of the organic coconut oil today when grocery shopping today. Looks nice. I think I've figured out a way to mix it with my PM tincture.

[Patience]

Thanks, Lotus. I picked up a jar of the organic coconut oil today when grocery shopping today. Looks nice. I think I've figured out a way to mix it with my PM tincture.

It's also awesome to cook with. Healthier by far than any butter substitute, with a unique flavor profile.

[Owena]

I agree, Patience, and it's also great for booby massages and imparts a nice aroma.