When some of us say re-wiring with pm or similar ,

I now agree with some here, its not,

Now after being on heavy spearmint for several days, I now

today feel "normal" again,

This backs my earlier theory and many on here as well thats its the T levels that do the harm or angst to us and simply inflames the

"hidden circuits" that are there,

High T , I go girle HARD,

Low to moderate T , wonder why I am doing this ?

However on a deeper level its all about hormone balancing, so just reducing T may not be enough for some yet it is ok for others,

With the afore mentioned testosterone toxicity thread that even a born male with no TG tendencies can be sent GIRLIE by ultra high levels of T , its obvious that were screwed.

Some of us may need T lowered or even driven down to very low levels ,

Others need the intro of e , not just to complete or settle the circuits , but to balance the T as well,

Now I am at the stage of finding out ?

Do I just lower t or carry on adding e as well ?

Umm we could ask the experts , ah there are none, us here seem to know more than them ?

Julie

Good day to all,

Julie after reading Patti's post about BO, I have to say there's some questions that need answered. For instance, Patti isn't seeing anything happening from BO, my short trial left me sexually frustrated.What if all this is just hype about BO, or there's not enough in it to benefit bio-males. And perhaps during this non-aromatization time our T-levels are going through the roof?, maybe that explains a few things in my case!

  Also, why did my not caring so much about the girlie things all of of sudden go girlie?, T-levels again?. I dunno, yes where's the experts?, oh wait maybe we are, cause we are the lab rats. I prefer "Pioneers" as opposed to "rodents".

L. 

Julie,

Like you, high T-levels send me over the edge (even to the point of considering transition). PM solves this for me by dramatically lowering my T levels.

One thing is odd, though. If I take too much PM then the gender dysphoria increases too. So I strive to find the "balance" where I am content to be what I am (at my age and with my family situation moving to transition is just too costly).

My body is slowly feminizing with my balanced dose. My breasts have definitely grown and are now starting to take a more female shape, and I have noticed some fat distribution taking place as well. I'm not sure how far it will progress, but I am OK with the changes (and do like them, in fact).

I'm off of PM for the next month or so but I intend to resume after my surgery.

Misty

I have to agree, re-wiring, as we refer to it here, is not actual "re-wiring" of our mental circuits. If the result of taking any one of our poisons was permanent, the term would be appropriate, but I've never heard anyone claim permanence. It's a phrase that I'm afraid will be hard to remove from our vernacular.

What you've said Julie, makes me think there might be some merit to a thought I've been pondering lately. I noticed when I started PM and SP, that my libido went down and with it, my desire to peruse porn, "M" and cross dress. When I added spearmint a month and a half ago, everything dropped another notch. I'd be really interested in knowing what might happen if I dropped the PM leaving only SP and spearmint. I suspect that my libido would stay low along with my deviant desires and my breasts would slow way down or stop altogether. I myself, don't want to give up the PM, for obvious reasons, to test my theory. ...And just to reiterate - THIS IS ONLY A THEORY. Wouldn't that be nice for a LOT of guys though and perhaps some here? I know hundreds of men who would like some relief from being led around by their you-know-what, but also have no interest whatsoever in getting a female physique. Our culture is already overloaded with sexual stimuli so what do we do? Let's make Viagra, Cialis, testosterone supplements, male enhancers. Good grief! How about a little LESS testosterone.

Indeed doodle

Lots of men do in fact take testosterone lowering herbs to drop their sex drive

To allow them to lead more normal lives

Julie

I have been a porn addict ever since I first saw it (about when I was 8.) It has disrupted my life and harmed my marriage immensely. I would go on 8 - 20 hours binges until my body collapsed from exhaustion. When I started taking SP, the urge was curbed a bit, but it really dropped off when began taking PM. I have had no uncontrollable urges since, and that's after taking it for only a short time. I, frankly, an absolutely relieved, but my libido has dropped in the bedroom too. I'm still finding a balance, but it feels great not to have my dick pulling me through my everyday life.

I don't think in my case it's brain re-wiring more of Balancing ie:- interest in visual porn now NIL but enjoying erotic stories in which relationships out weigh the wam bam thank you side of sex, I like the way I can now relate to my friendships with females with out my brain thinking I wonder what she would be like in bed.

When I started taking SP, the urge was curbed a bit, but it really dropped off when began taking PM. I have had no uncontrollable urges since, and that's after taking it for only a short time. I, frankly, an absolutely relieved, but my libido has dropped in the bedroom too. I'm still finding a balance, but it feels great not to have my dick pulling me through my everyday life.

Yep, that's what I'm talking about. Whether or not my regime inflates my chest is yet to be seen but without a doubt, it's curbing all the above mentioned desires that I hate so much. Hate because they can control me and hate because they are generally "masculine" cravings and feel like a cancer or virus living in me. Why would a girl like me have cravings like that?

If I were you, I'd be telling my wife what you said above. Most women I know would be glad to "get it" a little less often in return for knowing that you're not looking at porn. She wants you heart more than your ...ah hum. And if there's a time in the future when she wants you to quit taking herbs, she'll be reminded of the "other" benefits of taking them. As for the bedroom, if you're like me, there was a period of adjustment a couple months in on NBE, where "it" worked but wouldn't stay functional very long. That has since corrected itself. Now the only "problem" is that "finishing" isn't as satisfying as it used to be. I'm not sure why. ...Sorry for all the quotes.

...I like the way I can now relate to my friendships with females with out my brain thinking I wonder what she would be like in bed.

Amen! And isn't it nice to be in touch with your emotions too? I actually know how I'm feeling and can express myself easier than my, very gentle and caring wife at the moment. It's crazy weird!

If you go to www:eunuch.org youll find that the Tyranny of Testosterone (probasbly not under that title) is not surprisingly a major theme, although there are quite a lof of transexuals there. Personally I have no desire for a sexless existence, and very low testosterone levels are widely indicated in medical literature to have dire effects for the male. I can't help feeling however that these effects do not apply to everyone since clearly many eunuchs are very functional. However I definitely don't think a sexlees existence is for me (or my wife), even though the prescription pharmaceuticals I have taken in the past have (very) effectively chemically castrated me. To start with, falling testosterone levels much increased my interest in porn,and increasingly as time went by,transexual and lesbian porn,possibly looking for assurance that sex still interested me, and then to look for alternative techniques, even if my capability to perform as a conventional male was withering away. During the same period I became interested in NBE, and even the weaker NBE herbs may have provided a form of HRT which helped me avoid the worst side effects of low T (some of the side effects I definitely see as desirable). Spiro seems to have been responsible for getting my breast growth on the move, but since I stopped that and the other most T-unfriendly meds, PM has taken over as my HRT, and I definitely like the results. Breast growth has not been spectacular, but my state of mind is much improved (I agree, not rewired), my interest in porn is near zero, and I simply don't know how much my physical bodily changes are due to PM or low T - probably the two working together. I wouldn't willingly do without PM, it is I believe responsible for my remaining sexuality becoming essentially female, but my presumably permanent low T is also very important. I think that I would be quite resistant to any suggestion that I should take testosterone replacement therapy.

In the context of this conversation, it might be worth remembering that sex addiction like all addictions requires ever increasing dosage to achieve the same high. Thus, as a junkie will continue shooting stronger doses searching for a way to maintain the original level of pleasure as tolerence grows, so a sex addict will seek out more and more extreme types of porn, as the original content loses its value through familiarity.