16-09-2011, 12:44 PM
Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto:
July 2 2007 at 9:33 PM Fennel Fairy (no login)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As we all know, the active ingredient that works as an androgen blocker in Saw Palmetto is beta-sitosterol. Here is a product called Prostate Miracle, which is 3,000 times more potent than saw palmetto. You would have to eat 2 lbs. of saw palmetto to get the same amount of beta-sitosterol as they have in ONE caplet of Prostate Miracle. Every caplet contains 300 mg of beta-sitosterol. The raw material for this is sugar cane instead of SP.
Here is the website:
http://www.prostate-miracle.com/
Author Reply
stefanie
(Login stefanie_ss) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 2 2007, 10:34 PM
i read that link. they say there is no side effects. but, if this product was reducing testosterone, which it does not state, i would think that there would be at least mild feminizing effects. even the prostate commercials state that there may be mild swelling of the breasts.
Moonstruck
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 2 2007, 10:49 PM
Cool!
Thank you!
I'm taking 15 SP's a day now, 5caps 3x a day.
Someone had written somewhere that you need to get the SP that claims to be "85-95% fatty acids and active sterols"
Example: http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w279/...cn4320.jpg
I will be looking into this for sure.
A few questions though. Why do they say on the label that women should not take this?
Another question because it's been awhile and I forgot.
I remember everyone saying that the herbal route is much safer and you don't risk harm to your liver or blood clots, vs man made synthetic hormones. But I can't remember *why* it's safer. I just can not remember.
Some of the girls are taking spironolactone but have problems with low blood pressure because of it.
But it's what everyone takes to reduce body hair. And here's the kicker, part of the TS process, they require you to go through THEIR hoops and see head shrinkers, doctors, etc. and shell out big $$$ all along the way.
And of course the docs prescribe all their dangerous chemicals that cost you BIG $$$$...
But, when I look at the SP thing, there are claims made that it too can be dangerous for your heart.
Hmmm.. But some other pages claim otherwise. What the heck?
Here's a few links on SP and it's active ingredient.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldness_tr...iandrogens
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saw_Palmetto
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saw_palmetto_extract
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sitosterol
Oh, and I caught something about melatonin having effects on fertility and "sexual growth in higher level mammals"
Hmmmm..... I wonder what that means?? I read something about taking melatonin and calcium tablets having some sort of positive effects. I wonder if this would in anyway have any benefit for transsexuals? (obviously not in the fertility dept. thought.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin#Fertility
_______________________________________
http://transhouston.com/members/blog/morticia
_______________________________________
Edit Message Delete Message
Blu-Jay
(no login) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 3:30 PM
The product claims that there are no side effects! When taking an anti-androgen,Feminizing or atleast partial feminizing would be a side effect. Would this assumption be right? Also with many anti-androgens like Propecia,finesteride and some others,The manufacturers warn that these Meds can decrease libido and may cause some swelling of the breasts.
I wonder if this product is so strong,Why wouldn,t it have some of these side effects? And would it benefit a Ts/Tg person to take this product,since the side effects are basicly what the Ts/Tg person wants.
Your Average male doesn't want to take Meds/products that have these effects. I realize that it blocks Dihyrdrotestosterone,which is good for treating the prostrate and treating hair loss, but is that enough?
Blu-Jay
Edit Message Delete Message
Fennel
(no login) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 5:00 PM
Yes, it blocks Dihyrdrotestosterone,which is good for treating the prostrate and treating hair loss. Same as Saw Palmetto does, because it's got the same active substance.
Side effects... Well maybe they chose not to mention them, or the recommended dose is low?
Edit Message Delete Message
stefanie
(Login stefanie_ss) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 6:35 PM
if you go to the Evanesce site, they claim that saw palmetto actually increases testosterone. but, there is so much conflicting information out there. for right now, i want to keep all functions (if you know what i mean). the Evanesce site claims, that there can be no feminization without reducing testosterone. then why have i increased 1 1/2" on my breasts?
Edit Message Delete Message
Blu-Jay
(no login) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 8:30 PM
You've reduced your testosterone enough to cause your breasts to grow. What they mean is your testosterone must be reduced to a bio females amount! Males and females need to have specific amount of testosterone in their bodys.
Testosterone is responsible for the libidos in both sexes!
If you read some of the articles about hormones on these TS/TG web sites, they explain clearly that testosterone must be greatly reduced in order to feminize. It's not just the Evanence site that makes that claim.
Now! What's happening to you is that your still at a good testosterone level,But the longer you do this you might end up losing more of your male functions.
Your libido might not completely disappear but it will take a little more work to get there.If you know what I mean. Things will still work but it might not be as spontaneous as before.
Losing some of your male functions is part of the whole package and one must face it, that this WILL HAPPEN !! There is something to the saying "Having the pie and wanting to eat it too"
I've mentioned this many times before, if you wish to feminize, you must be prepared to take the good with the not so good. It doesn't work both ways.There are alot of articles writen by people that have gone through this that back that up. :-)
Blu-Jay
Edit Message Delete Message
Alien Sheep
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 8:32 PM
well, if you read the wikipedia info above on SP, it's an anti-androgen.
I would suspect commercial site above is giving out misleading or incorrect information for profit sake.
I would rather trust the wiki info as they stand to gain nothing at all vs the other site that is pimping their product.
Ya know?
_______________________________________
http://transhouston.com/members/blog/morticia
_______________________________________
Edit Message Delete Message
Blu-Jay
(no login) Saw Palmetto July 3 2007, 9:53 PM
Yes I agree with you Moonstruck! The Evanense web site is the only one where I've read that SP converts back to testosterone. Although I've read that some body builders take SP and the last thing on earth they want to do is reduce their testosterone levels. Hmmmm?
I geuss that's what Stefanie means by conflicting info.
I believe that SP is an anti-androgen and I use it too, But I wonder about how effective it is for feminizing? I know when I took higher doses,I was getting hot flashes,Then I reduced it by one pill and I was fine. Just to clarify The SP I'm taking is 160mgs. pure SP extract. I was taking 3 caps a day,now I'm only taking two with a couple of cups of stinging Nettle tea.
Edit Message Delete Message
Alien Sheep
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 10:20 PM
I'm taking 15 caplets a day of SP. I'm taking the 85-95% stuff.
Feminizing effects? Well, I can't tell you if it's the SP, the estrogen or both. But something is working right, for me.
I've been told by some other TS girls that it takes anti-androgens to erase male characteristics such as muscle definition.
Well, I have no male type muscle definition. None. Nada. Zip. My arms are now sort of soft and fleshy, like a womans.
So are my legs. Especially my legs. I can see that they are more plump and curvy like a woman's legs, no muscle at all.
So much so that it thrills me to no end. It's a very, very good feeling to look down and see female legs on this body.
My skin all over feels very much different that ever before. It's just soft. I mean like female soft.
Over all, my body, from the neck down is very different than it was a year ago this time.
My face may be changed too, they all say it does but I couldn't tell you because I don't look in the mirror.
Looking in the mirror makes me ill. Other people have commented that I look different though. Duh.
And my poor little titties, well, they're there but they are a loooooooooong way away from being luscious fun bags.
I had to go out today to do some onsite work and I has in a place that was *full* of pretty women.
It really depressed me because I was checking them out and trying to compare myself to them.
Well, there just isn't any comparison. They have the real deal and I got the sh*t end of the life stick.
After I left there I had to go to the store and a few other places. Pretty women everywhere.
And more depression. I'm soooo far away from what I want to be that I don't know if I can ever make it there in time.
You know, what's so f**ked up? I'm feminized enough that I no longer belong to the "male club" (thank god!) but I'm no where near even getting into the door of the female club. Ya know what I mean?
What really scares me is that in the end, I'll be stuck somewhere in limbo, not accepted by any and hated by all.
That's why I'm preparing myself to live a life alone, burning bridges and running people off.
Many me
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 7 2007, 8:09 AM
Speaking of the feminizing effects of natural herbs and natural estrogens...
They say that herbs can't feminize a male body?
Pfffft..
http://bayimg.com/fAdApaABh
and
http://bayimg.com/aADfhaabF
I dunno about you but that pretty much looks to me like "myth busted"...
That's what I've achieved going into month 7 of my DIY herbal transsexual project.
Just imagine 2 years from now...
July 2 2007 at 9:33 PM Fennel Fairy (no login)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As we all know, the active ingredient that works as an androgen blocker in Saw Palmetto is beta-sitosterol. Here is a product called Prostate Miracle, which is 3,000 times more potent than saw palmetto. You would have to eat 2 lbs. of saw palmetto to get the same amount of beta-sitosterol as they have in ONE caplet of Prostate Miracle. Every caplet contains 300 mg of beta-sitosterol. The raw material for this is sugar cane instead of SP.
Here is the website:
http://www.prostate-miracle.com/
Author Reply
stefanie
(Login stefanie_ss) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 2 2007, 10:34 PM
i read that link. they say there is no side effects. but, if this product was reducing testosterone, which it does not state, i would think that there would be at least mild feminizing effects. even the prostate commercials state that there may be mild swelling of the breasts.
Moonstruck
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 2 2007, 10:49 PM
Cool!
Thank you!
I'm taking 15 SP's a day now, 5caps 3x a day.
Someone had written somewhere that you need to get the SP that claims to be "85-95% fatty acids and active sterols"
Example: http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w279/...cn4320.jpg
I will be looking into this for sure.
A few questions though. Why do they say on the label that women should not take this?
Another question because it's been awhile and I forgot.
I remember everyone saying that the herbal route is much safer and you don't risk harm to your liver or blood clots, vs man made synthetic hormones. But I can't remember *why* it's safer. I just can not remember.
Some of the girls are taking spironolactone but have problems with low blood pressure because of it.
But it's what everyone takes to reduce body hair. And here's the kicker, part of the TS process, they require you to go through THEIR hoops and see head shrinkers, doctors, etc. and shell out big $$$ all along the way.
And of course the docs prescribe all their dangerous chemicals that cost you BIG $$$$...
But, when I look at the SP thing, there are claims made that it too can be dangerous for your heart.
Hmmm.. But some other pages claim otherwise. What the heck?
Here's a few links on SP and it's active ingredient.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldness_tr...iandrogens
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saw_Palmetto
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saw_palmetto_extract
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sitosterol
Oh, and I caught something about melatonin having effects on fertility and "sexual growth in higher level mammals"
Hmmmm..... I wonder what that means?? I read something about taking melatonin and calcium tablets having some sort of positive effects. I wonder if this would in anyway have any benefit for transsexuals? (obviously not in the fertility dept. thought.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin#Fertility
_______________________________________
http://transhouston.com/members/blog/morticia
_______________________________________
Edit Message Delete Message
Blu-Jay
(no login) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 3:30 PM
The product claims that there are no side effects! When taking an anti-androgen,Feminizing or atleast partial feminizing would be a side effect. Would this assumption be right? Also with many anti-androgens like Propecia,finesteride and some others,The manufacturers warn that these Meds can decrease libido and may cause some swelling of the breasts.
I wonder if this product is so strong,Why wouldn,t it have some of these side effects? And would it benefit a Ts/Tg person to take this product,since the side effects are basicly what the Ts/Tg person wants.
Your Average male doesn't want to take Meds/products that have these effects. I realize that it blocks Dihyrdrotestosterone,which is good for treating the prostrate and treating hair loss, but is that enough?
Blu-Jay
Edit Message Delete Message
Fennel
(no login) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 5:00 PM
Yes, it blocks Dihyrdrotestosterone,which is good for treating the prostrate and treating hair loss. Same as Saw Palmetto does, because it's got the same active substance.
Side effects... Well maybe they chose not to mention them, or the recommended dose is low?
Edit Message Delete Message
stefanie
(Login stefanie_ss) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 6:35 PM
if you go to the Evanesce site, they claim that saw palmetto actually increases testosterone. but, there is so much conflicting information out there. for right now, i want to keep all functions (if you know what i mean). the Evanesce site claims, that there can be no feminization without reducing testosterone. then why have i increased 1 1/2" on my breasts?
Edit Message Delete Message
Blu-Jay
(no login) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 8:30 PM
You've reduced your testosterone enough to cause your breasts to grow. What they mean is your testosterone must be reduced to a bio females amount! Males and females need to have specific amount of testosterone in their bodys.
Testosterone is responsible for the libidos in both sexes!
If you read some of the articles about hormones on these TS/TG web sites, they explain clearly that testosterone must be greatly reduced in order to feminize. It's not just the Evanence site that makes that claim.
Now! What's happening to you is that your still at a good testosterone level,But the longer you do this you might end up losing more of your male functions.
Your libido might not completely disappear but it will take a little more work to get there.If you know what I mean. Things will still work but it might not be as spontaneous as before.
Losing some of your male functions is part of the whole package and one must face it, that this WILL HAPPEN !! There is something to the saying "Having the pie and wanting to eat it too"
I've mentioned this many times before, if you wish to feminize, you must be prepared to take the good with the not so good. It doesn't work both ways.There are alot of articles writen by people that have gone through this that back that up. :-)
Blu-Jay
Edit Message Delete Message
Alien Sheep
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 8:32 PM
well, if you read the wikipedia info above on SP, it's an anti-androgen.
I would suspect commercial site above is giving out misleading or incorrect information for profit sake.
I would rather trust the wiki info as they stand to gain nothing at all vs the other site that is pimping their product.
Ya know?
_______________________________________
http://transhouston.com/members/blog/morticia
_______________________________________
Edit Message Delete Message
Blu-Jay
(no login) Saw Palmetto July 3 2007, 9:53 PM
Yes I agree with you Moonstruck! The Evanense web site is the only one where I've read that SP converts back to testosterone. Although I've read that some body builders take SP and the last thing on earth they want to do is reduce their testosterone levels. Hmmmm?
I geuss that's what Stefanie means by conflicting info.
I believe that SP is an anti-androgen and I use it too, But I wonder about how effective it is for feminizing? I know when I took higher doses,I was getting hot flashes,Then I reduced it by one pill and I was fine. Just to clarify The SP I'm taking is 160mgs. pure SP extract. I was taking 3 caps a day,now I'm only taking two with a couple of cups of stinging Nettle tea.
Edit Message Delete Message
Alien Sheep
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 3 2007, 10:20 PM
I'm taking 15 caplets a day of SP. I'm taking the 85-95% stuff.
Feminizing effects? Well, I can't tell you if it's the SP, the estrogen or both. But something is working right, for me.
I've been told by some other TS girls that it takes anti-androgens to erase male characteristics such as muscle definition.
Well, I have no male type muscle definition. None. Nada. Zip. My arms are now sort of soft and fleshy, like a womans.
So are my legs. Especially my legs. I can see that they are more plump and curvy like a woman's legs, no muscle at all.
So much so that it thrills me to no end. It's a very, very good feeling to look down and see female legs on this body.
My skin all over feels very much different that ever before. It's just soft. I mean like female soft.
Over all, my body, from the neck down is very different than it was a year ago this time.
My face may be changed too, they all say it does but I couldn't tell you because I don't look in the mirror.
Looking in the mirror makes me ill. Other people have commented that I look different though. Duh.
And my poor little titties, well, they're there but they are a loooooooooong way away from being luscious fun bags.
I had to go out today to do some onsite work and I has in a place that was *full* of pretty women.
It really depressed me because I was checking them out and trying to compare myself to them.
Well, there just isn't any comparison. They have the real deal and I got the sh*t end of the life stick.
After I left there I had to go to the store and a few other places. Pretty women everywhere.
And more depression. I'm soooo far away from what I want to be that I don't know if I can ever make it there in time.
You know, what's so f**ked up? I'm feminized enough that I no longer belong to the "male club" (thank god!) but I'm no where near even getting into the door of the female club. Ya know what I mean?
What really scares me is that in the end, I'll be stuck somewhere in limbo, not accepted by any and hated by all.
That's why I'm preparing myself to live a life alone, burning bridges and running people off.
Many me
(Login moonstruck61) Re: Less pills - More effect. An alternative to Saw Palmetto: July 7 2007, 8:09 AM
Speaking of the feminizing effects of natural herbs and natural estrogens...
They say that herbs can't feminize a male body?
Pfffft..
http://bayimg.com/fAdApaABh
and
http://bayimg.com/aADfhaabF
I dunno about you but that pretty much looks to me like "myth busted"...
That's what I've achieved going into month 7 of my DIY herbal transsexual project.
Just imagine 2 years from now...