[beverley.rose]

Beverley says hers was 280, but I wonder if that should be -280, because I've seen definite TS's report scores in the high MINUS 200's in other places.

I have just redone it and scored 200 - I guess it depends on the mood I am in, but 200 is still well inside category 4


Score: -650 to -389, COGIATI classification ONE, STANDARD MALE
Score: -390 to -129, COGIATI classification TWO, FEMININE MALE
Score: -130 to +129, COGIATI classification THREE, ANDROGYNE
Score: +130 to +389,COGIATI classification FOUR, PROBABLE TRANSSEXUAL
Score: +390 to +650, COGIATI classification FIVE, TRANSSEXUAL

For all you who are panicking....

Type 3

What this means is that the Combined Gender Identity And Transsexuality
Inventory has classified your internal gender identity to be essentially
androgynous, both male and female at the same time, or possibly neither.
In some cultures in history, you would be considered to be a third sex,
independent of the polarities of masculine or feminine. Your gender issues
are intrinsic to your construction, and you will most likely find your
happiness playing with expressing both genders as you feel like it.

And for me... type 4

What this means is that the Combined Gender Identity And Transsexuality
Inventory has classified your internal gender identity to be essentially
feminine, but with some masculine or androgynous traits. It is very
possible that you are a candidate for a diagnosis of transsexualism. You
show a strong degree of gender dysphoria. At the very least, further
investigation should be undertaken. Your COGIATI score places you
among the majority of those diagnosed as transsexuals, the 'late presentation'
transsexual.

(I have made a bit of an edit in this last one as I know Chrissie disliked the original wording)

Beverley.

Edit: I have gone back and scored it ruthlessly, erring towards the masculine where I was in any doubt and I dropped it to 170. Still well inside group 4

[chrissie]

Thanks Beverley.
When I took the Cognati, I had taken no hormones and was still trying to suppress my transsexuality
I am convinced tht there is a huge chasm, that divides TS from TV. That said, we have a huge communality. We all have to face the same hurdles of intolerance and the need to pass as fem; it is that, which binds us together, as fellow souls. It is also why, I have good TV friends.
For the same reasons, and more, it is why I hope that I will not retreat form this world, to live in stealth. I was given incredible help, when, I most needed it and hope I can re-pay that debt.

[beverley.rose]

Thanks Beverley.
When I took the Cognati, I had taken no hormones and was still trying to suppress my transsexuality. I am convinced tht there is a huge chasm, that divides TS from TV.

I know what you mean, and neither TS nor TV seems to address what some on here want - to be very male but with breasts.

I think that the herbs have unlocked stuff that was previously suppressed by me, but I have always been female in my dreams and it is only since January that I have started being female in my own life.

Was this caused by dropping T levels as I aged? Did the T help me suppress my urges? I kept them down for 15 years at one time but eventually something as simple as an overwhelming desire to paint my toenails did me in. It was the straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak. It released something in me and I was doomed from that point.

Isabelle says (and I have read elsewhere) that brain gender is set before birth and I am not disagreeing with her because I think it is right, but whatever my brain gender I am certain I do not want to be a man with breasts. I thought I did when I started, I thought that breasts would help me pass as a TV but I am now going beyond that. This week I start laser treatment for hair removal and PM is my gateway to a different kind of life. Not better or worse, but different. I know that there is no shining gateway of happiness to pass through. I am neither blinkered, nor hopeful, nor stupid.

TS or extreme TV? I do not know. Ask Chrissie for an opinion (I will not be offended) because she has met me and sometimes others see more clearly than we see ourselves. I do not know if it even makes a difference to me anymore as long as I get to remain Beverley.

One thing I am certain of - I would rather tell people that I am TS than TV. What does that say about me?

Beverley

[breastman59]

I just took the test...scored an 85, which doesn't really surpise me....as a male, a gay male, wanting and needing to have breasts but still wanting part of me to remain male...but do enjoy many feminine things...starting more and more to really figure me out, and this has taken me years to figure out...from the cross dressing as a kid with my moms stuff....loved the feeling of nylons on....to a wrecked marriage...all starting to make sense with who i really am.
now the trick is finding someone compatiable who would want to date both of me...lol

[beverley.rose]

now the trick is finding someone compatiable who would want to date both of me...lol

Just be yourself (yourselves?) and let that person find you. Hang out in TV/TS/CD groups and meetings.

Be yourself.

Beverley

[chrishoney]

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade; just trying to offer a word of caution, especially about what you find on the web. The following is from Ann Lawrence's website (http://www.annelawrence.com/faqs.html#tests):

11. What do you think of on-line gender tests, such as the COGIATI and the Moir-Jessel Brain Sex test?

I think that both the COGIATI and the Moir-Jessel tests are little more than pseudoscientific nonsense and that anyone trying to figure out his or her gender identity issues would be well advised to ignore both.

The following is from an entry in Wikipedia on the author of the test:

Reitz created the COGIATI (Combined Gender Identity And Transsexuality Inventory), a prototype test for people who think they might qualify as pre-op, pre-transitional male-to-female transsexuals, but feel uncertain. She claims on her Transsexuality website that some medical professionals have adopted her prototype test instead of developing a better version, and she expresses mixed feelings about this. She cautions that the COGIATI has many flaws and is not a reliable test for diagnosing transsexualism/gender identity disorder.[6]

Controversy
Despite Reitz' insistence that the COGIATI is unfinished and not to be taken seriously, its emphasis on stereotypical gender roles has sparked controversy as some people who have taken the test in the process of exploring their gender identity have later said that the test's results skewed their understanding of themselves.[7]

Just be careful reading too much, if anything at all, into COGIATI test scores. It's likely they're pretty much meaningless.

Cheers.

[beverley.rose]

I am not basing my decisions primarily on the COGIATI, but the questions are insightful enough if you really think about answering them honestly.

For example, when I last did it (some years ago) I scored 70 which is 'androgynous' and I remember the question about an accident removing your genitals - how would feel? I crossed my legs, went Argghhhh and ticked the "that would be terrible" box. This time round I ticked the "It would not bother me" box. Things change...

Ann Lawrence does not believe in 'brain gender' either - she says that, in her opinion, hormonal changes affect the brain and make physical changes.

"It has been known for years that changes in androgen levels during adulthood can change the volume of sexually dimorphic brain nuclei in the expected direction in experimental animals (Cooke, Tabibnia, & Breedlove, 1999). Changes in hormone levels in adult transsexuals plausibly can have similar effects on sexually dimorphic brain structures." http://www.annelawrence.com/brain-sex_critique.html

There is very little agreement in this hazy twilight world between the genders.

Beverley

[beverley.rose]

Just read this on Lawrence's website

"Does the desire for sex reassignment in autogynephilic MtF transsexuals represent a mental disorder? I contend that it does. To meaningfully address the question, one must attempt to define the term mental disorder, ... According to Wakefield and First, a mental disorder is "a 'harmful mental dysfunction,' with harm being determined by social values and the word dysfunction referring to the failure of a mental mechanism to perform its natural (i.e., evolutionarily selected) function" "

http://www.annelawrence.com/desire_for_s...order.html

Hmmm... I am glad she is not my doctor.

Beverley

[sfem]

Me too. Anybody who use the phrases social values and natural function to describe a single concept and isn't exploring the evolution of societies is just trying to justify their societal conditioning.

About those tests, any test that you can clearly see the result of as you do it isn't a test, it's an exercise. Most of the questions, if not all of them by their wording, are questions about what you think is expected of men or women and some of them are even backwards to the gender roles of other societies. Drivel.

[chrishoney]

I'm not trying to pour oil on the fire but...do you understand what she means by "autogynephilic MtF transexuals"? She started a firestorm of controversy with her introduction of that term many years ago, and factions of the transgendered world practically go postal at the mere mention of that term or her name. Did you also know she is a MtF transexual woman herself and has walked the talk? Did you read the entire article? I think her argument has merit based on her rationale and evidence she presents. Is she right? I have no idea, and I'm not saying she is, just that her thesis has an internal logic and makes sense from a particular point of view.

She says later in the article:

If the foregoing analysis is correct, then the desire for sex reassignment in autogynephilic MtF transsexuals -- that is, in many or most nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals -- represents a genuine mental dysfunction.

Is this mental dysfunction harmful? Does it cause significant distress or otherwise significantly decrease the overall well-being of affected persons? Clinicians have observed for decades that it does. Benjamin (1966) famously observed that "there is hardly a person so constantly unhappy (before sex change) as the transsexual" (p. 66).

She goes on to say:

If this analysis is correct, then many or most nonhomosexual men who seek or undergo sex reassignment have a genuine mental disorder. These individuals often benefit from psychiatric, hormonal, and surgical treatment of their disorder (Meyer et al., 2001); the DSM-5 should include a diagnosis applicable to them.

The main intent of her article was that the DSM should contain a diagnosis that correctly identifies this subset of individuals with gender identity disorders. In the USA, the DSM is like the bible of mental disorders. If it isn't in the DSM, it's thought to be a made-up problem, and likely not covered by insurance or validly treated by health and mental-health care practitioners. In plain english, I think she is saying get the definition of the underlying problem correct in this set of individuals, so they can get the treatment that helps them best. Sounds like she is a champion of your cause, not an antagonist.

Just my opinion though.