[Lotus]

So, what if we knew when (the time of day) E was released and the amount, would it change you're NBE strategy?.

I would think to some degree. If your Andros are way high, you would then use stronger or more AA. Thereby maybe even lowering your progesterone and estrogens?? I would think, if the last statement would be true, then it would be safer, quicker and more economical????

Good points, I haven't seen anything yet to suggest when it's more beneficial, attack or defend cycles. I think we have to look at the "lock and key theory" to understand what can work better. When there's an excess (let's say it's E, choose the flavor, nbe or hrt) the binding process (which causes growth) can't all activate at the same time, so the excess just flops around and does nothing, it's a waste. The question is for how long does it stay that way (yes, that would be half-life's) the goal is to examine that process so we can affect a more efficient and economical cycle, (meaning a daily one).




And here's our transports-



   

[WannaBePearShaped]

Since we are talking about estrogen,would a combination of White Peony and pygeum be strong enough for a biological female so that they wouldn't have to take any phytoestrogens?Or would they still need one and which do you recommend and at what doses?Also,would Maca affect the WP,Pygeum combo?

[The First Aria]

Since we are talking about estrogen,would a combination of White Peony and pygeum be strong enough for a biological female so that they wouldn't have to take any phytoestrogens?Or would they still need one and which do you recommend and at what doses?Also,would Maca affect the WP,Pygeum combo?

I would think WBPS, that would depend on how much estrogens are in your body. If I understand things, if all were equal in strength of changing things, then they would negate each other. That maybe why some GG's have small breasts and more "blocky" looking??

[Lotus]

Since we are talking about estrogen,would a combination of White Peony and pygeum be strong enough for a biological female so that they wouldn't have to take any phytoestrogens?Or would they still need one and which do you recommend and at what doses?Also,would Maca affect the WP,Pygeum combo?

WP traditionally has been used for menstrual pains (cramping), the added benefit is aiding with converting free testosterone (which is the active part of T) to E.

Maca is a adaptogen, imo it can cause interference in the stomach for some, can effect other supplements?, possibly.

According to Dr. William Wong, (a PhD and natuaropath) you have to ingest 2-3 tablespoons of maca daily to have a physiological effect. Maca contains plant sterols that are precursors to testosterone and progesterone and also has DIM, which blocks and metabolizes estrogen. Dr. Wong also states that maca does not slow thyroid function as the cabbage-based DIM does.

Are you concerned about excess androgens?, I ask because pygeum may not be the one you need. Pygeum reduces prolactin, which you'll need for breast growth.

Have you looked into:

Pumpkin Seed Oil: Has been demonstrated to inhibit DHT formation through the inhibitory effect on 5-alpha-reductase activity. Pumpkin seed oil breaks down DHT via the liver. It's also slightly estrogenic.

[WannaBePearShaped]

Since we are talking about estrogen,would a combination of White Peony and pygeum be strong enough for a biological female so that they wouldn't have to take any phytoestrogens?Or would they still need one and which do you recommend and at what doses?Also,would Maca affect the WP,Pygeum combo?

WP traditionally has been used for menstrual pains (cramping), the added benefit is aiding with converting free testosterone (which is the active part of T) to E.

Maca is a adaptogen, imo it can cause interference in the stomach for some, can effect other supplements?, possibly.

According to Dr. William Wong, (a PhD and natuaropath) you have to ingest 2-3 tablespoons of maca daily to have a physiological effect. Maca contains plant sterols that are precursors to testosterone and progesterone and also has DIM, which blocks and metabolizes estrogen. Dr. Wong also states that maca does not slow thyroid function as the cabbage-based DIM does.

Are you concerned about excess androgens?, I ask because pygeum may not be the one you need. Pygeum reduces prolactin, which you'll need for breast growth.

Have you looked into:

Pumpkin Seed Oil: Has been demonstrated to inhibit DHT formation through the inhibitory effect on 5-alpha-reductase activity. Pumpkin seed oil breaks down DHT via the liver. It's also slightly estrogenic.

I have a slight bit more androgens than thats normal(I wouldn't call it excessive) but I will definitely look into Pumpkin Seed Oil.So, WP isn't strong enough to be on its own with an anti-androgen then?And maca is counterproductive?By the way,I'm looking for mostly butt growth but boobs would be nice too Im sorry...I'm still a bit confused >.<

[WannaBePearShaped]

Since we are talking about estrogen,would a combination of White Peony and pygeum be strong enough for a biological female so that they wouldn't have to take any phytoestrogens?Or would they still need one and which do you recommend and at what doses?Also,would Maca affect the WP,Pygeum combo?

WP traditionally has been used for menstrual pains (cramping), the added benefit is aiding with converting free testosterone (which is the active part of T) to E.

Maca is a adaptogen, imo it can cause interference in the stomach for some, can effect other supplements?, possibly.

According to Dr. William Wong, (a PhD and natuaropath) you have to ingest 2-3 tablespoons of maca daily to have a physiological effect. Maca contains plant sterols that are precursors to testosterone and progesterone and also has DIM, which blocks and metabolizes estrogen. Dr. Wong also states that maca does not slow thyroid function as the cabbage-based DIM does.

Are you concerned about excess androgens?, I ask because pygeum may not be the one you need. Pygeum reduces prolactin, which you'll need for breast growth.

Have you looked into:

Pumpkin Seed Oil: Has been demonstrated to inhibit DHT formation through the inhibitory effect on 5-alpha-reductase activity. Pumpkin seed oil breaks down DHT via the liver. It's also slightly estrogenic.

I have a slight bit more androgens than thats normal(I wouldn't call it excessive) but I will definitely look into Pumpkin Seed Oil.So, WP isn't strong enough to be on its own with an anti-androgen then?And maca is counterproductive?By the way,I'm looking for mostly butt growth but boobs would be nice too Im sorry...I'm still a bit confused >.<

[Lotus]

I wouldn't necessarily rule out maca, like I said (some people) you won't know unless you try it, everyone's different.

WP isn't the strongest, and that's ok cause we don't want the strongest, too much sends the balance in the wrong direction. A slight androgen increase would (should) be ok with PSO and WP.

What's your phytoestrogen?

[WannaBePearShaped]

Hops or Red Clover...I'm undecided between them >.< I really want to try Doll's program but tweaked a bit

[Dynseli]

Since we are talking about estrogen,would a combination of White Peony and pygeum be strong enough for a biological female so that they wouldn't have to take any phytoestrogens?Or would they still need one and which do you recommend and at what doses?Also,would Maca affect the WP,Pygeum combo?

I think WP is a main phytoestrogen, it makes estrogens out of testosterone (It's the only one I found in pubmed to do that). Those two (and PSO) sound like a good combination. Maca is good for symptoms and is nutritious. Perhaps it raises the overall amount of ability of the body for hormones.

Pygeum reduces prolactin, which you'll need for breast growth.

My theory is there needs to be a combination of an herb that decreases prolactin (only by means of raising estrogen) while there is another herb that increases prolactin. Same for estrogen and progesterone. There was a post where Surfer Joe said, increasing progesterone and estrogen (I think it was those two) together cause a ballooning effect. I've noted that estrogen, and progesterone with prolactin lower each other, perhaps taking them in proportionate balance, while they lower each other, is helpful. (They also break each other down in to weaker hormones, which, are also helpful, but can exist longer together for more effect).

Pumpkin Seed Oil: Has been demonstrated to inhibit DHT formation through the inhibitory effect on 5-alpha-reductase activity. Pumpkin seed oil breaks down DHT via the liver. It's also slightly estrogenic.

Pumpkin seed sounds good.

WP isn't the strongest, and that's ok cause we don't want the strongest, too much sends the balance in the wrong direction. A slight androgen increase would (should) be ok with PSO and WP.

Just curious, which aromatase is stronger than WP? Is it safflower? I've only found WP in Pubmed text (about being an aromatase).

[Lotus]

Hops or Red Clover...I'm undecided between them >.< I really want to try Doll's program but tweaked a bit

This was an interesting study, first I've seen of it.

Hops reduces estrogens. Hops beer was able to reduce aromatase synthesis activity, but no direct effect of hops on aromatase shown. Effect of hop (Humulus lupulus L.) flavonoids on aromatase (Estrogen synthase) activity

I've tried hops, it didn't work for me, I even tried it as a tea, which was god awful. WP can work as an phytoestrogen (but not as a main source) with GG (genetic girls) T isn't produced in significant amounts, it's just like E being produced GM (genetic males), not in significant amounts.

Prolactin along with progesterone produce side branching, while E produces outward growth. Obviously, a missed growth spurt in puberty stalled the production along the way for smaller breasted women.

Good thought though. Red clover, yeah I dunno, (I've tried that too). How about fennel and fenugreek to start?, those would hit the targets you're aiming at, of course it's your decision.

• FENUGREEK- Prolactin stimulate, increases production of estrogen, phytoestrogen, adaptogen
  

FENUGREEK- Moderate Interaction

• FENNEL-Promotes milk production, nutrient rich for NBE growth, stimulates the growth of breast tissue

FENNEL -Moderate Interaction

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Ok I'm just gonna throw this out there about butt growth, hips too. A phytoestrogen cream works, the source (anybody's choice in phyto's actually, preferably starting with an extract mixed with a carrier oil). My choice was PM extract mixed with vitamin E oil, or coconut oil.