26-08-2011, 12:12 PM
progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment
September 25 2007 at 3:00 PM wishfulthinking (Login wishfullthinking)
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Ok my wife tells me I have some development but.... Its been two months on program. I see somethings in the mirror. When I message them it feels like there is more tissue, the shape is different, there is more depth and the tissue underneath seems to have a different texture. When I message upward a fair ammount of the tissue hangs over, and Oh its more than a hansful now. But I feel no buds under the nipples, or any tenderness in the nipple area, although the nipples get hard for no reason at all, all the time. I think it is to early for anything to happen but more than once I've turned unconsiously in the mirror and the male thing screams "breasts" and I'm shocked to realize its me, sooo what is happening, is anything happening. I'd post a pic but would be to embaresed to post in the women's section. I also made a mistake of not understanding the program page and didn't set one up or do any of the measurements either so I'm confused is something happening would like to post a pic so maybe some one could give me some feed back but now way with the girls, so ideas guys.
Author Reply
gingerD
(Login gingerD)
SENIOR MEMBER Re: progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment September 25 2007, 4:06 PM
i think it helps having a visual aid.
i suggest taking a picture for you
And if and when you feel comfortable post your pics on main page, or if you would prefer put a link on here or email people direct with a photo bucket link that way people can only see it if you have invited them to look.
i can only imagine how worried you must feel, it took me over 6 months to post my pics, but i do like to click on them,and i surprisingly like them
My program is very lazy and i never give acurate acounts of anything in it really just write my feelings and what im taking.
just start from now, write what you are taking and your feelings etc and up date when ever you fancy, remember this journey isnt just about breasts and its nice to look back and see the days you had negative thoughts ands the days when you were happy,body changes etc.
Oh and P.s if the wife has noticed then by god you will have grown u know us MRS's we notice everything-so well done and hope things continue going well 4 ya
Morticia
(Login moonstruck61) Re: progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment September 25 2007, 6:31 PM
well beyond any shadow of a doubt my titties are growing. But slow.
However my lower half is changing rapidly, so much so that I can tell the difference on a day to day basis.
It's sooo weird (but very cool) to look down and see that my lower half is totally female in appearance, that is provided I cover the offending bits. There is no way you could look at my lower half and think "male", provided the offending bits are hidden away. It's amazing how fast that change is taking place. I wish my tits would grow as fast too.
But, considering my age, it's possible they may never get BIG. From everything I've read people in my age range usually don't get very much development in the tits.
There's enough there for a handful (remember the old saying that more than a handful is a waste) and plenty enough to play with but still a long way from being in proportion to my frame/body size & shape.
In the end, I'll likely end up having a boob job.
Fennel
(no login) More than a handful is a waste September 25 2007, 9:21 PM
True Morticia! And even Arnold agrees:
http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/7150/...aysrk8.jpg
Davilee
(Login Davi-lee) Re: progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment October 4 2007, 6:50 AM
Wish'...I think that you are experiencing the fat development that is the first effect of estrogenic compounds.
That is the most common effect..fat deposits tend to build up quicker in older people ..Im talking hypothetically..I dont know what your age is...
For males *typically*,there is the tendency for fat to collect in the breast ares due to testosterone production lessening,also more fat collects in the belly area.Some men get more overall fat deposits also.
These just are possibilites; but they are true for many males.
Edit Message Delete Message
Davilee
(Login Davi-lee) Whats your program now Wish'?? October 4 2007, 7:02 AM
Oh hey Ive been meaning to ask what all are you taking and in what quantities.
I thought you said somewhere but I cant find it in the older posts.
I guess ya didnt say before.
I was wanting to know because I wanted to see if its got anything to do with your slower reactions.
You may not be taking enough of certain things.
Edit Message Delete Message
wishfulthinking
(Login wishfullthinking) program update October 6 2007, 2:24 PM
Hi DaviLee. Thank you for your interest Today marks two and half months and right now I am just working my progam waiting. My program hasn't changed much since I started. I want to give it chance to work before I start changing it. I started with this basic program
Morning Progesterone cream on inner thigh
10 massage with soy oil and fenugeek
Morning, Afternoon and Evening
2x Capsules 540mg Saw Palmetto
1x Capsule 610mg Fenugeek
1x Capsule 430mg Red Clover
2x Capsules Gaba 750 at night only
Afternoon 1 soy protien shake for added protien
After listening to the fourm on progesteron I stopped using it for a month and a half. I gave the E a chance to build in my body much like a young girl does then added the Progesteron back in I do it now two weeks on and two weeks of and I massage it into the breast it self on TB advice. At the begining of month two I added one additional 610 Fenugeek at night. At the end of month one I added 1TP of ground Licorice root to my Daily protien shake at noon with a liver support tinture from my hebalist. I also added at noon with the shake a Tincture from my herbalist that she uses to bring in breast milk. The Tincture is made up of "Red Rassberry Leaf,nettle, blessed thistle, fennel,Vitex,Basil, Goats Rus,Chamomile,blue Verrain,Plantain,and fenugreek. So that is where I am at. I plan on continuing this unchanged for the next month and a half to see what results I get. I plan to contine on to the 6 month point and then take a least a month break to clease and let the body adjust. The fact that I seem to have about a 25% shrikage of the testes has me concerned and since I don't want to losse some of that I think I need to back of and recover at the 6 month point but i will see when that time comes. It you have any coments on this I would love to hear if any one has any insight I'd love it so please have at it.
Edit Message Delete Message
Davilee
(Login Davi-lee) Hiya,how ya doin? October 7 2007, 4:39 PM
Wowee....that tincture blend sounds like fun...that oughta do something.
ooh..Id like to try that blend just to see what happens..
Watch out for the >Vitex<,its not very good for males really,it can boost Testo.,I believe.Its a hormone balancer in many respects.Its better for women,AND..since you are taking it as a tincture you are getting a stronger dosing of that.
Hmmm...you are getting testes shrinkage,eh?...well,dont know if you consider that good or bad....somethings working then if you are getting that effect.Mine did start degenerating and then reversed that and then returned to nearly their original size and got firm and heavy feeling.Im smaller than average anyway..but,I dont know....its not good I think....thats not the result I was wanting to see. It may mean that my body is trying to balance out my hormones. So,I may have to get serious about the Testo.reduction by chemicals..OR I shudder to think,...castration..then I would definitely need to get serious about real drug HRT,I wouldnt have a choice then,my health would suffer I think,if I didnt start increasing my estrogens.
Ive collected all the ingredients of Estroven sans the kudzu,and I feel my licorice will stand in its place just fine. Perhaps not...they do have their differences in constituents.Licorice is more complicated.
That hasnt been any world rocking effects for me,yet,except maybe weight gain...well,I cant really say what that estroven blend is doing yet,Ive been skeptical of it,since it doesnt seem like much happens.
Anyways,,,,yah I like your program...it seems like its good...you are getting the good amounts of SW and possibly just a bit low on FG and RC.
I need to find my quick check list for daily herb amounts.
I would break up the licorice into smaller amounts scattered through the day,esp.if you are taking 1tsp. all at one time,it can cause hypertension more likely if you take it in one big dose,and there's the issue with that much estrogenics backing up being processed by the liver...the liver may just flush most of the effective chemicals right out if its all taken at the same time. The liver will remove 65% of the estrogens from a dose,..thats numbers for the stronger types though,I dont know exactly how the liver reacts to the weaker estrogenic compounds.
...I take 2-3 00 caps of licorice every 8 hrs.,,but I make my own caps so its easier for me to dose how I want.
I dont think ya should take Clover along with Licorice,they are both stronger PE's,I would drop one or the other and then change them up every now and then.
I dont take RC,because it actually causes weight LOSS ,and Im not into that.
I think its a good PE but it just has some drawbacks for me.
What mg level per oz. is your PROG.??
If its low like 400-500mg/oz. then you may not be getting enough PROG.
Thats the borderline minimum per product suggested by several hormone sites.
My product info. that came with my prog. says that women typically produce 20-30mg a day of progesterone.Men half of that,or even less.
The PROG thang is just so screwy and incomplete as to understanding of what all it does. I read on one site that there are prog. receptors in all types of muscles and tissues ;the medical establishment just dont know why or what they do,in some cases.
September 25 2007 at 3:00 PM wishfulthinking (Login wishfullthinking)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok my wife tells me I have some development but.... Its been two months on program. I see somethings in the mirror. When I message them it feels like there is more tissue, the shape is different, there is more depth and the tissue underneath seems to have a different texture. When I message upward a fair ammount of the tissue hangs over, and Oh its more than a hansful now. But I feel no buds under the nipples, or any tenderness in the nipple area, although the nipples get hard for no reason at all, all the time. I think it is to early for anything to happen but more than once I've turned unconsiously in the mirror and the male thing screams "breasts" and I'm shocked to realize its me, sooo what is happening, is anything happening. I'd post a pic but would be to embaresed to post in the women's section. I also made a mistake of not understanding the program page and didn't set one up or do any of the measurements either so I'm confused is something happening would like to post a pic so maybe some one could give me some feed back but now way with the girls, so ideas guys.
Author Reply
gingerD
(Login gingerD)
SENIOR MEMBER Re: progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment September 25 2007, 4:06 PM
i think it helps having a visual aid.
i suggest taking a picture for you
And if and when you feel comfortable post your pics on main page, or if you would prefer put a link on here or email people direct with a photo bucket link that way people can only see it if you have invited them to look.
i can only imagine how worried you must feel, it took me over 6 months to post my pics, but i do like to click on them,and i surprisingly like them
My program is very lazy and i never give acurate acounts of anything in it really just write my feelings and what im taking.
just start from now, write what you are taking and your feelings etc and up date when ever you fancy, remember this journey isnt just about breasts and its nice to look back and see the days you had negative thoughts ands the days when you were happy,body changes etc.
Oh and P.s if the wife has noticed then by god you will have grown u know us MRS's we notice everything-so well done and hope things continue going well 4 ya
Morticia
(Login moonstruck61) Re: progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment September 25 2007, 6:31 PM
well beyond any shadow of a doubt my titties are growing. But slow.
However my lower half is changing rapidly, so much so that I can tell the difference on a day to day basis.
It's sooo weird (but very cool) to look down and see that my lower half is totally female in appearance, that is provided I cover the offending bits. There is no way you could look at my lower half and think "male", provided the offending bits are hidden away. It's amazing how fast that change is taking place. I wish my tits would grow as fast too.
But, considering my age, it's possible they may never get BIG. From everything I've read people in my age range usually don't get very much development in the tits.
There's enough there for a handful (remember the old saying that more than a handful is a waste) and plenty enough to play with but still a long way from being in proportion to my frame/body size & shape.
In the end, I'll likely end up having a boob job.
Fennel
(no login) More than a handful is a waste September 25 2007, 9:21 PM
True Morticia! And even Arnold agrees:
http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/7150/...aysrk8.jpg
Davilee
(Login Davi-lee) Re: progress? thoughts, confussion, embaresment October 4 2007, 6:50 AM
Wish'...I think that you are experiencing the fat development that is the first effect of estrogenic compounds.
That is the most common effect..fat deposits tend to build up quicker in older people ..Im talking hypothetically..I dont know what your age is...
For males *typically*,there is the tendency for fat to collect in the breast ares due to testosterone production lessening,also more fat collects in the belly area.Some men get more overall fat deposits also.
These just are possibilites; but they are true for many males.
Edit Message Delete Message
Davilee
(Login Davi-lee) Whats your program now Wish'?? October 4 2007, 7:02 AM
Oh hey Ive been meaning to ask what all are you taking and in what quantities.
I thought you said somewhere but I cant find it in the older posts.
I guess ya didnt say before.
I was wanting to know because I wanted to see if its got anything to do with your slower reactions.
You may not be taking enough of certain things.
Edit Message Delete Message
wishfulthinking
(Login wishfullthinking) program update October 6 2007, 2:24 PM
Hi DaviLee. Thank you for your interest Today marks two and half months and right now I am just working my progam waiting. My program hasn't changed much since I started. I want to give it chance to work before I start changing it. I started with this basic program
Morning Progesterone cream on inner thigh
10 massage with soy oil and fenugeek
Morning, Afternoon and Evening
2x Capsules 540mg Saw Palmetto
1x Capsule 610mg Fenugeek
1x Capsule 430mg Red Clover
2x Capsules Gaba 750 at night only
Afternoon 1 soy protien shake for added protien
After listening to the fourm on progesteron I stopped using it for a month and a half. I gave the E a chance to build in my body much like a young girl does then added the Progesteron back in I do it now two weeks on and two weeks of and I massage it into the breast it self on TB advice. At the begining of month two I added one additional 610 Fenugeek at night. At the end of month one I added 1TP of ground Licorice root to my Daily protien shake at noon with a liver support tinture from my hebalist. I also added at noon with the shake a Tincture from my herbalist that she uses to bring in breast milk. The Tincture is made up of "Red Rassberry Leaf,nettle, blessed thistle, fennel,Vitex,Basil, Goats Rus,Chamomile,blue Verrain,Plantain,and fenugreek. So that is where I am at. I plan on continuing this unchanged for the next month and a half to see what results I get. I plan to contine on to the 6 month point and then take a least a month break to clease and let the body adjust. The fact that I seem to have about a 25% shrikage of the testes has me concerned and since I don't want to losse some of that I think I need to back of and recover at the 6 month point but i will see when that time comes. It you have any coments on this I would love to hear if any one has any insight I'd love it so please have at it.
Edit Message Delete Message
Davilee
(Login Davi-lee) Hiya,how ya doin? October 7 2007, 4:39 PM
Wowee....that tincture blend sounds like fun...that oughta do something.
ooh..Id like to try that blend just to see what happens..
Watch out for the >Vitex<,its not very good for males really,it can boost Testo.,I believe.Its a hormone balancer in many respects.Its better for women,AND..since you are taking it as a tincture you are getting a stronger dosing of that.
Hmmm...you are getting testes shrinkage,eh?...well,dont know if you consider that good or bad....somethings working then if you are getting that effect.Mine did start degenerating and then reversed that and then returned to nearly their original size and got firm and heavy feeling.Im smaller than average anyway..but,I dont know....its not good I think....thats not the result I was wanting to see. It may mean that my body is trying to balance out my hormones. So,I may have to get serious about the Testo.reduction by chemicals..OR I shudder to think,...castration..then I would definitely need to get serious about real drug HRT,I wouldnt have a choice then,my health would suffer I think,if I didnt start increasing my estrogens.
Ive collected all the ingredients of Estroven sans the kudzu,and I feel my licorice will stand in its place just fine. Perhaps not...they do have their differences in constituents.Licorice is more complicated.
That hasnt been any world rocking effects for me,yet,except maybe weight gain...well,I cant really say what that estroven blend is doing yet,Ive been skeptical of it,since it doesnt seem like much happens.
Anyways,,,,yah I like your program...it seems like its good...you are getting the good amounts of SW and possibly just a bit low on FG and RC.
I need to find my quick check list for daily herb amounts.
I would break up the licorice into smaller amounts scattered through the day,esp.if you are taking 1tsp. all at one time,it can cause hypertension more likely if you take it in one big dose,and there's the issue with that much estrogenics backing up being processed by the liver...the liver may just flush most of the effective chemicals right out if its all taken at the same time. The liver will remove 65% of the estrogens from a dose,..thats numbers for the stronger types though,I dont know exactly how the liver reacts to the weaker estrogenic compounds.
...I take 2-3 00 caps of licorice every 8 hrs.,,but I make my own caps so its easier for me to dose how I want.
I dont think ya should take Clover along with Licorice,they are both stronger PE's,I would drop one or the other and then change them up every now and then.
I dont take RC,because it actually causes weight LOSS ,and Im not into that.
I think its a good PE but it just has some drawbacks for me.
What mg level per oz. is your PROG.??
If its low like 400-500mg/oz. then you may not be getting enough PROG.
Thats the borderline minimum per product suggested by several hormone sites.
My product info. that came with my prog. says that women typically produce 20-30mg a day of progesterone.Men half of that,or even less.
The PROG thang is just so screwy and incomplete as to understanding of what all it does. I read on one site that there are prog. receptors in all types of muscles and tissues ;the medical establishment just dont know why or what they do,in some cases.