[BigDee]

Thanks Lotus, that's indeed me.

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What it means Vegetarian capsules??

Vegetarian capsules use gelatin made from vegetable sources, regular gelatin is made from animal by-products (e.g. pork and beef bones, hooves and skin.)

BigDave

[spanky]

Lotus -

So, if I understand correctly, it may be desirable to increase one's SHBG, if one wishes to have more feminine traits, or at least to increase one's relative level of estrogen. And if that is correct, how do you increase your SHBG levels, thus reducing testosterone levels in relation to estrogen? I take it that you would want to increase your aromatase.

In http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=19581, you indicated that soy protein isolate, sunflower oil, soybean oil, safflower oil, corn oil and alcohol can increase aromatase. Are there other sources?

spanky

[GoneGirl]

Hi Lotus,
I've been reading your posts on an approach for NBE that is based heavily on the aromatization of free T to increase estradiol levels in the body and, presumably, to produce better breast growth.

This is my understanding of the rationale for your idea:

Aromatase Approach

1. Estradiol is produced in the body from free T by the action of the enzyme aromatase.



2. There are herbs, like White Peony, that increase aromatase activity, so that if there is sufficient free T available, much of it will be converted to estradiol which will (along with miroestrol from PM) promote breast growth.

3. Herbs which lower one's free T level should be avoided because less estradiol can be produced (through aromatizaton) which will result in less or slower breast growth.



The Traditional Approach, which many of us have been pursuing, is based on driving down one's free T level with herbs like Spearmint in conjunction with taking sometimes large doses of PM. The lower free T level means that less estradiol is produced via aromatization, relying primarily on miroestral from PM with its ability to mimic estradiol to produce the desired breast growth.

The question is: Which approach is more effective?

The Aromatase Approach produces larger amounts of estradiol which is known to be much more powerful than miroestrol from PM. Therefore, less PM needs to be taken to get the equivalent estrogenic effect of the traditional approach. That's a plus.

On the other hand, the higher free T level in the Aromatase Approach means there will be more available T in the blood to compete at receptor sites, and more free T available to be converted to DHT making it more difficult to achieve other feminizing goals such as eliminating body hair, reducing muscle mass, etc. A strong anti-5ar herb should be included in the program (e.g., Reishi, Pygeum, Chinese Skullcap) to counter the higher DHT levels.

Since the Traditional Approach (attacking free T) has been shown to be effective over the years, I personally would hesitate to spend a year or more on the Aromatase Approach should it prove to be less effective. Again, that my personal opinion, but I'm open to having my mind changed if a strong case can be made.

It would be wonderful if someone would construct a program based on the Aromatase Approach to test its efficacy.

Any volunteers?

Clara

[Lotus]

Lotus -

So, if I understand correctly, it may be desirable to increase one's SHBG, if one wishes to have more feminine traits, or at least to increase one's relative level of estrogen. And if that is correct, how do you increase your SHBG levels, thus reducing testosterone levels in relation to estrogen? I take it that you would want to increase your aromatase.

In http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=19581, you indicated that soy protein isolate, soybean oil, safflower oil, corn oil and alcohol can increase aromatase. Are there other sources?

spanky

Hi spanky,

This is from the mayo clinic,

Clinical Information
Sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG), a homodimeric 90,000 to 100,000 molecular weight glycoprotein, is synthesized in the liver. Metabolic clearance of SHBG is biphasic, with a fast initial distribution from vascular compartment into extracellular space (half-life of a few hours), followed by a slower degradation phase (half-life of several days).

SHBG binds sex steroids with high affinity (KD approximately 10[-10]M), dihydrotestosterone (DHT) ->testosterone (T) ->estrone/estradiol (E). Although each monomeric subunit contains 1 steroid binding site, the dimer tends to bind only a single sex-steroid molecule. The main function of SHBG is sex-steroid transport within the blood stream and to extravascular target tissues. SHBG also plays a key role in regulating bioavailable sex-steroid concentrations through competition of sex steroids for available binding sites and fluctuations in SHBG concentrations. Because of the higher affinity of SHBG for DHT and T, compared to E, SHBG also has profound effects on the balance between bioavailable androgens and estrogens. Increased SHBG levels may be associated with symptoms and signs of hypogonadism in men, while decreased levels can result in androgenization in women.

http://www.mayomedicallaboratories.com/t...etive/9285


Estrogens, particularly in oral form, stimulate the hepatic production of sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) which binds with relatively high affinity to T, thereby reducing the bioavailability of androgens. The consequence of these dual effects is that both total and bioavailable testosterone levels are significantly reduced in women taking oral contraceptives or estrogen replacement for ovarian insufficiency.

[Lotus]

Lotus -

So, if I understand correctly, it may be desirable to increase one's SHBG, if one wishes to have more feminine traits, or at least to increase one's relative level of estrogen. And if that is correct, how do you increase your SHBG levels, thus reducing testosterone levels in relation to estrogen? I take it that you would want to increase your aromatase.

In http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=19581, you indicated that soy protein isolate, soybean oil, corn oil and alcohol can increase aromatase. Are there other sources?

spanky

Hi spanky,

This is from the mayo clinic,

Clinical Information
Sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG), a homodimeric 90,000 to 100,000 molecular weight glycoprotein, is synthesized in the liver. Metabolic clearance of SHBG is biphasic, with a fast initial distribution from vascular compartment into extracellular space (half-life of a few hours), followed by a slower degradation phase (half-life of several days).

SHBG binds sex steroids with high affinity (KD approximately 10[-10]M), dihydrotestosterone (DHT) ->testosterone (T) ->estrone/estradiol (E). Although each monomeric subunit contains 1 steroid binding site, the dimer tends to bind only a single sex-steroid molecule. The main function of SHBG is sex-steroid transport within the blood stream and to extravascular target tissues. SHBG also plays a key role in regulating bioavailable sex-steroid concentrations through competition of sex steroids for available binding sites and fluctuations in SHBG concentrations. Because of the higher affinity of SHBG for DHT and T, compared to E, SHBG also has profound effects on the balance between bioavailable androgens and estrogens. Increased SHBG levels may be associated with symptoms and signs of hypogonadism in men, while decreased levels can result in androgenization in women.

http://www.mayomedicallaboratories.com/t...etive/9285


Estrogens, particularly in oral form, stimulate the hepatic production of sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) which binds with relatively high affinity to T, thereby reducing the bioavailability of androgens. The consequence of these dual effects is that both total and bioavailable testosterone levels are significantly reduced in women taking oral contraceptives or estrogen replacement for ovarian insufficiency.

As far Aromatase boosters go I read that tequila is one, it's also important to note that these are listed as AI's,

Aromatase Inhibitors
Foods that inhibit aromatase include blueberries, celery, sour cherries, cranberries, red grapes, purple grape juice, horseradish, kale, tomatoes, white button mushrooms and cruciferous vegetables such as broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower and Brussels sprouts. FoodForBreastCancer.com says these foods also enhance the effectiveness of aromatase inhibitors. If you have estrogen-dependent breast cancer, seek the advice of your oncologist before including these foods in your diet.

[Lotus]

Hi Lotus,
I've been reading your posts on an approach for NBE that is based heavily on the aromatization of free T to increase estradiol levels in the body and, presumably, to produce better breast growth.

This is my understanding of the rationale for your idea:

Aromatase Approach

1. Estradiol is produced in the body from free T by the action of the enzyme aromatase.



2. There are herbs, like White Peony, that increase aromatase activity, so that if there is sufficient free T available, much of it will be converted to estradiol which will (along with miroestrol from PM) promote breast growth.

3. Herbs which lower one's free T level should be avoided because less estradiol can be produced (through aromatizaton) which will result in less or slower breast growth.



The Traditional Approach, which many of us have been pursuing, is based on driving down one's free T level with herbs like Spearmint in conjunction with taking sometimes large doses of PM. The lower free T level means that less estradiol is produced via aromatization, relying primarily on miroestral from PM with its ability to mimic estradiol to produce the desired breast growth.

The question is: Which approach is more effective?

The Aromatase Approach produces larger amounts of estradiol which is known to be much more powerful than miroestrol from PM. Therefore, less PM needs to be taken to get the equivalent estrogenic effect of the traditional approach. That's a plus.

On the other hand, the higher free T level in the Aromatase Approach means there will be more available T in the blood to compete at receptor sites, and more free T available to be converted to DHT making it more difficult to achieve other feminizing goals such as eliminating body hair, reducing muscle mass, etc. A strong anti-5ar herb should be included in the program (e.g., Reishi, Pygeum, Chinese Skullcap) to counter the higher DHT levels.

Since the Traditional Approach (attacking free T) has been shown to be effective over the years, I personally would hesitate to spend a year or more on the Aromatase Approach should it prove to be less effective. Again, that my personal opinion, but I'm open to having my mind changed if a strong case can be made.

It would be wonderful if someone would construct a program based on the Aromatase Approach to test its efficacy.

Any volunteers?

Clara

Very nice Clara,

Sometimes moving new ideas forward is controversial, I completely understand conventional thinking on this, I actually did volunteer myself about 2 months ago, so all I can tell you is it worked for me, although individual results will vary imo. It's risky, do I want to abandon what I've been told is successful even though I'm not seeing the results I want?, well that's the $64,000.00 question, only you (members) can decide that question. I ask again what's deemed successful?, imo it's a full C or D-cup, what's the percentage of that based on traditional programs?, (not picking).

Btw, I've been hunting for something stronger then WP to get the job done, unfortunately it's all I've found. So any help on that would be appreciated.

[Larana]

Hi Lotus,
I've been reading your posts on an approach for NBE that is based heavily on the aromatization of free T to increase estradiol levels in the body and, presumably, to produce better breast growth.

This is my understanding of the rationale for your idea:

Aromatase Approach

1. Estradiol is produced in the body from free T by the action of the enzyme aromatase.



2. There are herbs, like White Peony, that increase aromatase activity, so that if there is sufficient free T available, much of it will be converted to estradiol which will (along with miroestrol from PM) promote breast growth.

3. Herbs which lower one's free T level should be avoided because less estradiol can be produced (through aromatizaton) which will result in less or slower breast growth.



The Traditional Approach, which many of us have been pursuing, is based on driving down one's free T level with herbs like Spearmint in conjunction with taking sometimes large doses of PM. The lower free T level means that less estradiol is produced via aromatization, relying primarily on miroestral from PM with its ability to mimic estradiol to produce the desired breast growth.

The question is: Which approach is more effective?

The Aromatase Approach produces larger amounts of estradiol which is known to be much more powerful than miroestrol from PM. Therefore, less PM needs to be taken to get the equivalent estrogenic effect of the traditional approach. That's a plus.

On the other hand, the higher free T level in the Aromatase Approach means there will be more available T in the blood to compete at receptor sites, and more free T available to be converted to DHT making it more difficult to achieve other feminizing goals such as eliminating body hair, reducing muscle mass, etc. A strong anti-5ar herb should be included in the program (e.g., Reishi, Pygeum, Chinese Skullcap) to counter the higher DHT levels.

Since the Traditional Approach (attacking free T) has been shown to be effective over the years, I personally would hesitate to spend a year or more on the Aromatase Approach should it prove to be less effective. Again, that my personal opinion, but I'm open to having my mind changed if a strong case can be made.

It would be wonderful if someone would construct a program based on the Aromatase Approach to test its efficacy.

Any volunteers?

Clara

Very nice Clara,

Sometimes moving new ideas forward is controversial, I completely understand conventional thinking on this, I actually did volunteer myself about 2 months ago, so all I can tell you is it worked for me, although individual results will vary imo. It's risky, do I want to abandon what I've been told is successful even though I'm not seeing the results I want?, well that's the $64,000.00 question, only you (members) can decide that question. I ask again what's deemed successful?, imo it's a full C or D-cup, what's the percentage of that based on traditional programs?, (not picking).

Btw, I've been hunting for something stronger then WP to get the job done, unfortunately it's all I've found. So any help on that would be appreciated.

accordingly White Peony is not pretty strong?You couldn't feel the effectiveness? The next step souldn't be dangerous way Lotus??

In the meantime: does its need stronger DHT blocker?

[spanky]

Hi Lotus,
I've been reading your posts on an approach for NBE that is based heavily on the aromatization of free T to increase estradiol levels in the body and, presumably, to produce better breast growth.

This is my understanding of the rationale for your idea:

Aromatase Approach

1. Estradiol is produced in the body from free T by the action of the enzyme aromatase.



2. There are herbs, like White Peony, that increase aromatase activity, so that if there is sufficient free T available, much of it will be converted to estradiol which will (along with miroestrol from PM) promote breast growth.

3. Herbs which lower one's free T level should be avoided because less estradiol can be produced (through aromatizaton) which will result in less or slower breast growth.



The Traditional Approach, which many of us have been pursuing, is based on driving down one's free T level with herbs like Spearmint in conjunction with taking sometimes large doses of PM. The lower free T level means that less estradiol is produced via aromatization, relying primarily on miroestral from PM with its ability to mimic estradiol to produce the desired breast growth.

The question is: Which approach is more effective?

The Aromatase Approach produces larger amounts of estradiol which is known to be much more powerful than miroestrol from PM. Therefore, less PM needs to be taken to get the equivalent estrogenic effect of the traditional approach. That's a plus.

On the other hand, the higher free T level in the Aromatase Approach means there will be more available T in the blood to compete at receptor sites, and more free T available to be converted to DHT making it more difficult to achieve other feminizing goals such as eliminating body hair, reducing muscle mass, etc. A strong anti-5ar herb should be included in the program (e.g., Reishi, Pygeum, Chinese Skullcap) to counter the higher DHT levels.

Since the Traditional Approach (attacking free T) has been shown to be effective over the years, I personally would hesitate to spend a year or more on the Aromatase Approach should it prove to be less effective. Again, that my personal opinion, but I'm open to having my mind changed if a strong case can be made.

It would be wonderful if someone would construct a program based on the Aromatase Approach to test its efficacy.

Any volunteers?

Clara

Very nice Clara,

Sometimes moving new ideas forward is controversial, I completely understand conventional thinking on this, I actually did volunteer myself about 2 months ago, so all I can tell you is it worked for me, although individual results will vary imo. It's risky, do I want to abandon what I've been told is successful even though I'm not seeing the results I want?, well that's the $64,000.00 question, only you (members) can decide that question. I ask again what's deemed successful?, imo it's a full C or D-cup, what's the percentage of that based on traditional programs?, (not picking).

Btw, I've been hunting for something stronger then WP to get the job done, unfortunately it's all I've found. So any help on that would be appreciated.

Wow. My head swims. Or does the breast stroke.

Isn't it true that there are adverse health effect of high levels of DHT and estradiol? If so, are these not risk factors for the aromatase approach?

[Boobsorbust86]

Lotus did you take your amazing pics off I don't see any

[bobie]

Lotus did you take your amazing pics off I don't see any

I think it was post 353 but the attachment isnt working, could be a forum glitch