[Elowyn]

Hello,

First of all, I'd like to say that Pueraria Mirifica is wonderful thus far. I would, however, like to ask whether the members of this forum whether they consider Saw Palmetto to be effective, and whether you'd recommend using it.

My routine at the moment is PM 2000mg/day and SP 1000mg/day, though the latter is dried fruit rather than standardized extract... An oversight on my part. I have noticed that SP causes a headache when I take 2000mg/day. (On a side note, I've added 1200mg of calcium a day, in two separate doses with my PM.)

In any case, my goals with NBE are to achieve a more feminine appearance and to positively affect my mental state. I notice that many users here do not list SP in their regimen. Is there a better anti-androgen to use? Is PM enough by itself? Simplifying my routine would be great, so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

[julieTG]

Elowen

In the early days of this site, many on here were using sp

Now however it seems that many gain mental benefits and growth without it

Julie

[onesexybitch]

The problem i see is there is a minimum amount of any drug that is necessary to get the desired effect.

When someone mixes drugs sometimes many many drugs, They are below that amount on all of the drugs that they are taking.

which means you are just adding a lot of different toxins to your body spending a lot of money with no chance of any results.

come on just take one drug at a time.

[AbiDrew85]

The problem i see is there is a minimum amount of any drug that is necessary to get the desired effect.

When someone mixes drugs sometimes many many drugs, They are below that amount on all of the drugs that they are taking.

which means you are just adding a lot of different toxins to your body spending a lot of money with no chance of any results.

come on just take one drug at a time.

You aren't adding anything. Go away already.

Anyways, back to the question... I find saw palmetto use to be troubling even when it does work.

For me, it caused a resistance to weight loss and a moderate amount of cellulite.

I AM still using anti-androgens though.

It depends what you're after and just where you are REALLY starting, what combination would therefore be best. For some folks, all they're wanting are the mental benefits and pm alone is perfectly fine for that, perhaps even best because breast growth and any other body feminizing effects aren't the primary concern and might even be something the user knows they'll have to "live with" but aren't actually wanting.

But you've stated that you desire the feminizing of characteristics...

To reaaaaally reallly get that you'll need an estrogen, a progesterone, and an antiandrogen, and possibly a galactagogue.

Precise dosing will need to be worked out by you through experimentation, and I do recommend cycling.

Personally, I've been using chinese skullcap, spearmint, pm, fg, and pc. I used to use sp, but discontinued it due to the aforementioned side effects.

[julieTG]

galactagogue

A what ?

[Lenneth]

galactagogue

A what ?

Medical Term.

-----------------------------------
galactagogue (ɡəˈlæktəˌɡɒɡ)

adjective

Meaning: inducing milk secretion
-----------------------------------

Back On Topic, I take SP myself and get benefits from it, however I recently changed to SP Extract and saw a significant improvement in overall bodily response to killing of the DHT, and encouraging growth.

Although for the last 2 months now I have been on a Very low dose of PM
(Payday was sadly very slow coming thanks to a overly finicky client)

but hope to be building back up to a full dose soon after my new PM shipment arrives, during the low dose time I never let up on the SP extract and as a result have not lost any of my growth (as little as their is, doubt i'm even a AA)

[flamesabers]

Hello Elowen.

I think pm by itself is sufficient for breast growth, brain rewiring and other feminization changes to the body. However, like with much of the rest of NBE, individual results can vary.

As far as simplifying your routine, my suggestion would be to drop the sp for now and do a trial run with just pm. If you like the results you get, than perhaps pm is all you need. If pm isn't showing signs of fulfilling your goals, I would suggest making a change like what AbiDrew's has mentioned or maybe switching to the extract form of sp.

[Elowyn]

I wasn't expecting so many replies so quickly! Thank you, everyone.

It seems like SP isn't as necessary as I'd thought. I guess I had the mindset of lowering my testosterone so the PM could be more effective... But PM alone does have some anti-androgen activity, no?
I've experienced no benefit from SP just yet, and I know it would probably take more time to see any changes, but I would rather drop it. The advice given to me in this topic has reinforced my decision to do so. I'd rather not take more substances than I need to, for both financial and health reasons.

Fenugreek did have some positive effects for me in terms of NBE, but I also experienced unwanted weight gain and increase in appetite, likely due to the effect of blood sugar reduction. I will probably have to look for alternatives if I choose to further supplement my regimen.

Thank you all once again!

[Lenneth]

I wasn't expecting so many replies so quickly! Thank you, everyone.

It seems like SP isn't as necessary as I'd thought. I guess I had the mindset of lowering my testosterone so the PM could be more effective...

SP does not Lower Testostrone, but it does Stop it from Converting to DHT, DHT will stop Breast Growth dead in its Tracks.

But PM alone does have some anti-androgen activity, no?
I've experienced no benefit from SP just yet, and I know it would probably take more time to see any changes, but I would rather drop it. The advice given to me in this topic has reinforced my decision to do so. I'd rather not take more substances than I need to, for both financial and health reasons.

Yes, PM also has an Anti-Androgen, but for many such as myself our bodies are far to efficient at converting T into DHT and need more help to curb it.

Fenugreek did have some positive effects for me in terms of NBE, but I also experienced unwanted weight gain and increase in appetite, likely due to the effect of blood sugar reduction. I will probably have to look for alternatives if I choose to further supplement my regimen.

Thank you all once again!

Fenugreek is good for stimulating Prolactin Production, which is beneficial to breast growth, but if you overdo it their is a chance you could start to lactate (not saying not take it, just saying to not overdo it).

It also makes you smell like Maple Syrup oddly enough...

[Elowyn]

In all honesty, I am a little conflicted. I would very much like to reduce the impact of androgens on my body (and mind). There has been mention of spearmint, which is reassuring. I actually drink spearmint tea on a daily basis simply because I like it, but I'm guessing I would need several cups more per day to reap any anti-androgenic benefits, right? I'll keep my eyes open for a capsule/tablet version, but until then, I'll try to bump up my consumption.

I also intend to use progesterone cream for one week out of each month. That seems to be the recommended method of using it, so I hope I see benefits.