Breast Growth For Genetic Males

Hello,

I am a long time lurker on this forum and I have learned a lot from all of your posts over the years.

I originally became interested in this forum since i was in an ANR relation with an ex-girlfriend and after we broke up I had some Motilum left over and I wondered if I could induce lactation in myself.

So at first I tried PM and some other herbs for a while.  Later I experimented with synthetic hormones and various anti-androgens to develop my breasts and feminize myself.  I researched HRT extensively before I began to experiment with self-medicating.  

I have also used hospital grade breast pumps at times and taken Motilum at different times even though I haven't probably developed enough breast tissue yet to lactate.

I enjoy wearing lingerie even though I am still very much in the closet with all of this.

I have noticed changes will on HRT that tend to lead me further down the path of wanting more feminization.

Anyway I wanted to thank all of the forum members that have provided me information and inspiration over the years, and I wanted to say Hi now that I am brave enough to actually post on this forum.

Darlene

Hi Darlene
Welcome to the forum.
How much growth do you have?
Have you thought of transition or are you just having fun?
Bobbi

(12-04-2018, 04:46 PM)Happyme Wrote: [ -> ]Hi Darlene
Welcome to the forum.
How much growth do you have?
Have you thought of transition or are you just having fun?
Bobbi

Hi Bobbi,

Thanks for the reply.  I will try replying again, my previous reply got lost somehow...

I wear a 38b to 40A/B bra, I don't have a soft tape for measuring so not sure of the amount of growth.  I am 6' 208lbs, 56 years old.    The longest I have been on HRT without a break is 3-4 months, but I have cycled on/off HRT many times.  I have had breast buds form and they flattened into disks with a hole in the center.  The bud discs develop more when I restart HRT.  I have been self conscious at times when taking a shower at the gym or going topless at a friends pool party when on HRT, I ended up getting in the pool so that my breasts were underwater.  When I am active on HRT my breasts project more when I am leaning forward.

I am not considering transitioning at this time, although I wouldn't rule out that possibility in the future.  For now I would like to strike a balance between my masculine and feminine side.  I do enjoy some of the calmness and pink fog when active on HRT.  Developing breasts and feminization is more than just fun for me now, I find I relate more and more to having breasts and developing female features and feminine emotions, etc.  I enjoy feeling my breasts swell on HRT, and the soreness of new growth, and how HRT affects my emotions, etc.

Starting/stopping HRT is not fun and often I feel sick for a period of time and have trouble concentrating and doing the engineering work that I do when altering my hormone levels.  I guess I tend to binge on HRT and cross dressing at this time, I am currently still very much in the closet with all of this.

Darlene

(13-04-2018, 05:15 PM)gcman01 Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-04-2018, 04:46 PM)Happyme Wrote: [ -> ]Hi Darlene
Welcome to the forum.
How much growth do you have?
Have you thought of transition or are you just having fun?
Bobbi

Hi Bobbi,

Thanks for the reply.  I will try replying again, my previous reply got lost somehow...

I wear a 38b to 40A/B bra, I don't have a soft tape for measuring so not sure of the amount of growth.  I am 6' 208lbs, 56 years old.    The longest I have been on HRT without a break is 3-4 months, but I have cycled on/off HRT many times.  I have had breast buds form and they flattened into disks with a hole in the center.  The bud discs develop more when I restart HRT.  I have been self conscious at times when taking a shower at the gym or going topless at a friends pool party when on HRT, I ended up getting in the pool so that my breasts were underwater.  When I am active on HRT my breasts project more when I am leaning forward.

I am not considering transitioning at this time, although I wouldn't rule out that possibility in the future.  For now I would like to strike a balance between my masculine and feminine side.  I do enjoy some of the calmness and pink fog when active on HRT.  Developing breasts and feminization is more than just fun for me now, I find I relate more and more to having breasts and developing female features and feminine emotions, etc.  I enjoy feeling my breasts swell on HRT, and the soreness of new growth, and how HRT affects my emotions, etc.

Starting/stopping HRT is not fun and often I feel sick for a period of time and have trouble concentrating and doing the engineering work that I do when altering my hormone levels.  I guess I tend to binge on HRT and cross dressing at this time, I am currently still very much in the closet with all of this.

Darlene

Thanks for the bio!
I guess your not married, which makes things so much easier.
Thats very interesting that your buds flatten to discs. I hadnt heard of that before.
You might want to PM Aria or read some of her threads. I think you might have some things in common and she can share her experience.
I think your feeling too self conscious about your breasts.
As you age ( I'm 69) your boobs get bigger and they sure do droop when you bend over. Thats all aging, and if you have a few extra pounds that helps boobage too.
You can get away with a lot of growth before you have to worry about WTF looks.
So do you notice any change in you engineering logic when you are on HRT?
ie the femme vs male mind?
Bobbi

(13-04-2018, 07:31 PM)Happyme Wrote: [ -> ]So do you notice any change in you engineering logic when you are on HRT?
ie the femme vs male mind?
Bobbi

Great question! I`d be interested to see if there was any changes too, there certainly was (is) for me.

(13-04-2018, 10:33 PM)Katie Wrote: [ -> ]

(13-04-2018, 07:31 PM)Happyme Wrote: [ -> ]So do you notice any change in you engineering logic when you are on HRT?
ie the femme vs male mind?
Bobbi

Great question!  I`d be interested to see if there was any changes too, there certainly was (is) for me.

Hi Bobbie and Katie,

Hmmm, what I have found is my memory and ability to concentrate seems foggier when on HRT, at least at first.  Maybe because my hormone levels and endocrine system had not stabilized yet?  I saw where Huggy compared HRT to whacking ones endocrine system with a stick and I suppose I have done that to myself a lot by starting/stopping HRT after a few months off and on.

I was working on an aircraft development program that required me to make many trips to Switzerland for the past 2-3 years.  Sometimes I was working there for 8-12 weeks at a time and I thought of that as opportunity to to continue my HRT while working there.  But I was concerned that the HRT would affect my work performance and ability to debug and my analytical thinking that often helps me solve engineering problems quickly, and in addition I had some fear of maybe my baggage being searched and not having a prescription since I am self medicating.

So working on that project also contributed to my starting/stopping HRT since I was traveling to Europe for work about every 3-4 months every time we had a new software load to integrate,  I would stop HRT before I left.

So I am not sure if 3-4 months is really long enough continuous use to tell how HRT affects my engineering thinking or problem solving?  Or maybe that is partly why I stop when I start to think differently?  I am not sure if I let myself change that far?  I can tell you my sense of smell changes, my skin gets drier, fingernails crack easier, emotionally I definitely am more sensitive as well while on HRT, I smell different, my pheromones probably change after a while.  Also I think my breasts are probably maybe a little past Tanner Stage 2, definitely my chest and nipples are much different than before I ever took PM or synthetic hormones.

So Katie how has HRT changed your thinking?

Darlene

(14-04-2018, 01:41 AM)gcman01 Wrote: [ -> ]So Katie how has HRT changed your thinking?

Darlene

well I`m an Electronics design engineer and as well as working on projects for others (contract work) I also have
my own projects on the go, some I`v been working on for decades. and One particular problem I`d had with one
project for nearly 30 years that i could never quite work out How it could be done, I actually Solved in less than 5
minutes whilst preparing food in the kitchen!
It wasn`t "Worked out" or calculated or anything hardcore Sciencey, it was more of just a creative Flow, like looking at it from a perspective I never knew existed and it just made sense to me, and I had a feeling like Why did you ever find this complicated?, it`s easy!

My designs have changed too, I`v even had several compliments on my work having a "Flair" and Elegance that others (guys) wished they had. I find I THINK less and FEEL more, it`s like a Flow rather than deliberate effort of distinct calculated steps, you seem to "Know" stuff but not quite sure How and probably couldn`t explain it to someone easily if asked How you arrived at such and such, it`s as much about Art as Science. I make less mistakes now even though my Male type "confidence" is gone, I get nervous and overwhelmed sometimes when I try to understand certain things and sometimes even cry because I don`t "get it" almost like my previous IQ has lowered, But... I have a Lot more patience now than before and will take a break and come back to it, unlike before when it was head down, get stuck in and DO NOT come out until you`ve conquered it (this has seen me locked away for DAYS on end in the past).
it`s as much about instinct/intuition now as it is cold hard maths (Boolean algebra and Machine Code mostly), I`m not Goal driven anymore and it`s not about the results, it`s about me Enjoying the process, and I`m getting more done in less time too, AND I love to have dance music playing while I work (I needed total silence before), a
Sybiotic relationship with a project now rather than something that must be Dominated and Controlled to get an
exact result as if it`s an "enemy" that must be subjugated and a chore to do it, it`s ceratinly less like hard work
Now and more of a dance partner.

I understand what you mean about that foggy headed thing, but because I have no choice but to continue my HRT, I can tell you what happens when you go further (for me anyway), it`s not Actually Fog! it IS the start of this new
way of "thinking" (it`s actually feeling), I found that in the beginning I used to fight this fog, i was used to doing things a certain way (unaware there Was even any other way! LOL) and that lead me to be very unhappy, it was
when i was fighting it that I would get overwhelmed and break down in tears thinking I`d ruined my life coz i
couldn`t do Electronics any more.
So I went into hiding, feeling rather sorry for myself for about 18 months, during which time I focused soley on my transition and very little else, i did no electronic or other engineering work at all, I even considered selling both businesses, besides, i was a girl, why would I want to do stuff like that anyway (I would reason).

Then from almost out of nowhere, I started getting little twinges of excitement when ever I saw a Circuit board, it
might be on Google or TV or whatever, and it was like Eye Candy for me LOL. these started leading to other
thoughts, and I also looked at my list of Stock and getting quite excited about all the cool things I could make
using those chips etc...
it was no longer just Stock held by the business earmarked for future projects that never ever really felt like Mine, Nope, this was like a kid with a huge pad of blank paper and 1000 color box of crayons being told to "have at!" LOL I hadn`t felt this way since I was a little girl going through the radio Shack catalogue! (pre testosterone poisoning).
I felt ownership of this Stock and all the lab equipment, it was all Mine and felt very much like it was some sort of inheritance left by some guy I once knew that passed away.

So I started going into the lab again, and it felt strange at first, as if i was an intruder in someone else place,
I spent many hours in tears just sitting there looking at the stuff and greiving for this guy that once owned it
all, but slowly over a few weeks that feeling began to fade and I felt like I had "Permission" to be there, and an
active desire to Use the stuff, so I did! and that "Fog" became a new way of doing things, something natural and
almost organic and I`d forgotten the Old ways, if i tried to remember them it was hard and awkward and
uncomfortable feeling, almost black and white and grainy, I had no choice now but to "go with the flow" as it was
the only way I know how to now, and it`s an ASSET!!! and not a fog as all, it`s your intuition and it`ll take faith
to trust it and overthinking will only lead to stress because it`s fighting it and not working WITH it!

Did I mention Multi-tasking? that really kicks in eventually too, when i`m at my desk working i`m like a
Pick`n`Place robot on Speed! and it`s effortless and so much fun if you have good music playing!
it`s no longer "Work" it`s a Joy, and I could spend hours and many many more pages trying to explain all the changes and with examples and still miss a load of stuff! overall i`m Much better at what I do now that I ever was before and I wouldn`t ever want to go back.

my advice would be to Don`t fight it, just let it happen, it`s a very Beautiful thing! xx

(14-04-2018, 01:36 PM)Katie Wrote: [ -> ]

(14-04-2018, 01:41 AM)gcman01 Wrote: [ -> ]So Katie how has HRT changed your thinking?

Darlene

well I`m an Electronics design engineer and as well as working on projects for others (contract work) I also have
my own projects on the go, some I`v been working on for decades. and One particular problem I`d had with one
project for nearly 30 years that i could never quite work out How it could be done, I actually Solved in less than 5
minutes whilst preparing food in the kitchen!
It wasn`t "Worked out" or calculated or anything hardcore Sciencey, it was more of just a creative Flow, like looking at it from a perspective I never knew existed and it just made sense to me, and I had a feeling like Why did you ever find this complicated?, it`s easy!

My designs have changed too, I`v even had several compliments on my work having a "Flair" and Elegance that others (guys) wished they had. I find I THINK less and FEEL more, it`s like a Flow rather than deliberate effort of distinct calculated steps, you seem to "Know" stuff but not quite sure How and probably couldn`t explain it to someone easily if asked How you arrived at such and such, it`s as much about Art as Science. I make less mistakes now even though my Male type "confidence" is gone, I get nervous and overwhelmed sometimes when I try to understand certain things and sometimes even cry because I don`t "get it" almost like my previous IQ has lowered, But... I have a Lot more patience now than before and will take a break and come back to it, unlike before when it was head down, get stuck in and DO NOT come out until you`ve conquered it (this has seen me locked away for DAYS on end in the past).
it`s as much about instinct/intuition now as it is cold hard maths (Boolean algebra and Machine Code mostly), I`m not Goal driven anymore and it`s not about the results, it`s about me Enjoying the process, and I`m getting more done in less time too, AND I love to have dance music playing while I work (I needed total silence before), a
Sybiotic relationship with a project now rather than something that must be Dominated and Controlled to get an
exact result as if it`s an "enemy" that must be subjugated and a chore to do it, it`s ceratinly less like hard work
Now and more of a dance partner.

I understand what you mean about that foggy headed thing, but because I have no choice but to continue my HRT, I can tell you what happens when you go further (for me anyway), it`s not Actually Fog! it IS the start of this new
way of "thinking" (it`s actually feeling), I found that in the beginning I used to fight this fog, i was used to doing things a certain way (unaware there Was even any other way! LOL) and that lead me to be very unhappy, it was
when i was fighting it that I would get overwhelmed and break down in tears thinking I`d ruined my life coz i
couldn`t do Electronics any more.
So I went into hiding, feeling rather sorry for myself for about 18 months, during which time I focused soley on my transition and very little else, i did no electronic or other engineering work at all, I even considered selling both businesses, besides, i was a girl, why would I want to do stuff like that anyway (I would reason).

Then from almost out of nowhere, I started getting little twinges of excitement when ever I saw a Circuit board, it
might be on Google or TV or whatever, and it was like Eye Candy for me LOL. these started leading to other
thoughts, and I also looked at my list of Stock and getting quite excited about all the cool things I could make
using those chips etc...
it was no longer just Stock held by the business earmarked for future projects that never ever really felt like Mine, Nope, this was like a kid with a huge pad of blank paper and 1000 color box of crayons being told to "have at!" LOL I hadn`t felt this way since I was a little girl going through the radio Shack catalogue! (pre testosterone poisoning).
I felt ownership of this Stock and all the lab equipment, it was all Mine and felt very much like it was some sort of inheritance left by some guy I once knew that passed away.

So I started going into the lab again, and it felt strange at first, as if i was an intruder in someone else place,
I spent many hours in tears just sitting there looking at the stuff and greiving for this guy that once owned it
all, but slowly over a few weeks that feeling began to fade and I felt like I had "Permission" to be there, and an
active desire to Use the stuff, so I did! and that "Fog" became a new way of doing things, something natural and
almost organic and I`d forgotten the Old ways, if i tried to remember them it was hard and awkward and
uncomfortable feeling, almost black and white and grainy, I had no choice now but to "go with the flow" as it was
the only way I know how to now, and it`s an ASSET!!! and not a fog as all, it`s your intuition and it`ll take faith
to trust it and overthinking will only lead to stress because it`s fighting it and not working WITH it!

Did I mention Multi-tasking? that really kicks in eventually too, when i`m at my desk working i`m like a
Pick`n`Place robot on Speed! and it`s effortless and so much fun if you have good music playing!
it`s no longer "Work" it`s a Joy, and I could spend hours and many many more pages trying to explain all the changes and with examples and still miss a load of stuff! overall i`m Much better at what I do now that I ever was before and I wouldn`t ever want to go back.

my advice would be to Don`t fight it, just let it happen, it`s a very Beautiful thing! xx

Hi Katie,

Thank you so very much for your reply, I really appreciate your sharing of your experience, and your story of doing engineering work while and during your transition.

I haven't shared this yet, but I also do subcontract work, actually I own 50% of an engineering job shop, but I just prefer to do engineering versus program management work myself.  Oh, I am an electrical engineer, I thought I wanted to do analog circuit design or RF design when I got out of school, but I was attracted more into control systems type of work, I do mainly real time embedded systems development, primarily on aircraft since I moved to Arizona from Dallas.  When we started this company 21 years ago, I described myself then as both an engineering pimp and prostitute, I have one surviving business partner, and I am in the process of selling my interest in my company at this time.

Thanks again for sharing how the rewiring of of how you think led you back to the work that you love to do.    I 've been doing the work I do for almost 34 years, and the only reason I continue doing it is for the creativity of it, at least in the few moments I am allowed to create something new.  From a moral aspect of the work that I do I have always desired to create things that benefit mankind rather than how can I say this, but kill other humans.

I was thinking after my last post, that what I wrote was not entirely accurate.  I wrote about my analytical thinking, but actually what is really true I have always relied on my intuition more than than my engineering peers.  I just was thinking that before I read your post Katie, I have in my engineering career found I have used my intuition much more than I would like to admit.   

Yes, and the feeling aspect of it.  I have an example not really feeling related directly, but long before I ever experimented with any hormonal changes, I had a problem similar to what you described I was having a hard time visualizing and solving, for me at that point in my life I ran a lot, long before my body wore out.  So I would run about 3 miles a day, and when I was running I think I could more attuned to my subconscious which actually had already solved the problem and when I was running I was able to be open to information from other levels of my thinking and much as you described I was able to see the solution in my mind.

I also have not shared yet I was an athlete in my past, I played American baseball which I was good enough athlete to try and play in college and later played mens senior baseball into my 40's.  I was primarily a pitcher, I had the desire of playing professional baseball in the US.  Well anyways, the main reason I mention sports is because of the feeling that you mentioned.  For me playing sports at a high level was all about feeling, at least when I was entirely present and playing well.  The speed of the reaction time required was far beyond what normal cognitive thinking is capable of in my opinion, hence to play you have let yourself go and just feel, at least I did.  What I experienced in baseball I threw at a batter I could feel the ball after I let it go.  Same with a batted ball being hit back at me I could feel the ball before I caught it, the ball was probably going 120-130 mph hit back at me.

Anyway. Katie your post got me thinking, I am starting to realize I have always had certain feminine mental characteristics, and abilities, even long before I ever thought about altering my hormones.  Another what I consider to be a feminine trait that I have inherently is interior decorating.  I am red-green color blind to some extent,but I can match colors and hues and fabrics better than any interior decorator I have met. I also enjoy wearing some shades of pink and purples, I think they look good with my skin tone.  I have never been attracted to the male gender, but the more I really think about myself, I can see feminine aspects that have been part of me all along.

Oh, and it is interesting you mention music.  I have always found I could concentrate better while listening to music, I always did my engineering homework while listening to music.

A little more of my background, my father was an electrical engineering professor at a local univerisity, he had a PH. D, in EE, so I was raised in an engineering environment and he taught me to think as an engineer I am sure while I was growing up.

Also thinking about it, I have had many transgender and gender different friends in my life, I just was recalling a very good friend of mine when I was in my early 20's Brad, that shared his gender challenges with me and experimentation when he attended UT Austin.  Unfortunately my friend Brad took his own life a few years after I got know him.

Yeah, I know just go with the flow.  I also know I am here writing to you for a reason.  And in the end I am very good with going with the flow myself.  I will have to ponder what the message is for myself in all of this.

Katie, again thank you so very much for your engineering transition story, I am very appreciative of your sharing.  I am also very glad for you how you have been open to the development of your new creative talents that you have developed.

Darelene

Hiya
 
Hope you don't mind my joining the conversation?  Seems that we may be on a similar page.  Apart from the obvious (why we are on this forum in the first place) we are about the same age and I have an engineering background too, though I come more from the mechanical and design side of engineering.  My last business before my life took a curveball to the back of the head was building high performance cars and custom motorcycles.
 
I also have been aware for a long time that my approach to design and problem solving didn't fit the usual "male" stereotype and I had a reputation for coming up with solutions and designs that people loved but they could never quite work out how I got there.  Over the years I had developed a way of working that was more about intuition than calculations.  I just put it down to having a knack or feel for the subject, but your comments are making me consider there might have been something else going on?  And I definitely agree with you on the idea of now being able to enjoy the process rather than just achieving the objective.
 
I absolutely get what you mean about that feeling of not being able to face the workshop.  My circumstances are such that being able to publicly transition is not an option for me at present, but the last couple of years of facing up to my GID has definitely shifted my mental state and perspective on things.  Anyways.... after a long absence from the workshop, circumstances pushed me back out there and the way I felt... well there was no other word for it... I was grieving!  And I definitely felt I was invading someone else's space!
 
A job that has been hanging around (from before the curveball) finally had to be faced.  I had left it gathering dust partly because I couldn't quite get my head around a few problems and it had become my nemesis!  But even though every fibre of my being was screaming for me to leave, I gritted my teeth and tried to work though it.  And slowly the tears started to settle (yes I had tears too).  But the interesting thing is that after a period of awkwardness I seemed to hit a new groove and I was able to resolve almost every issue that had been plaguing me, and I achieved what would have normally taken me a week or so in just 3 days!  It's good stuff too!  Strangely, I still feel I am borrowing someone else's workshop but I think I am slowly coming to terms with that now.
 
From your comments and my own experience, perhaps we could almost have the best of both worlds?  Tap into the old male experience that took years to perfect, but then process it from a more creative perspective?       
 
A suggestion if I may Darlene?  It seems there are many problems that arise from an on-off approach to NBE/HRT.  But the worse of the issues can be mitigated by going to low dose rather that stopping and then starting again.  Understand the reasoning for self medicating and the worries of taking them through customs.  So why not take a supply of the meds out of the packaging and put them in a customs acceptable vitamin bottle?  Especially if you could find something where the pills looks similar, how would they know?   Perhaps not enough to support a full programme and raise suspicions but enough to keep yourself in balance?  
 
Huggy

Hi Huggy,

Thanks for the feedback, and yes I welcome you joining this discussion and I am open to feedback from any forum member!

I must admit that your Katie's responses about your experience with problem solving work during HRT and your challenges and successes has led me to think about my own goals of what I want from my experimentation with HRT or if I should go further with it.  Your posts have given me a lot to think about, as well some additional insight into myself.

Yes, I had thought about the repackaging of the HRT products for traveling, and I did start to do that before one of my trips to Lucerne, but then chickened out and left it at home before I left.  My contract working there has ended for now, so I am not traveling internationally for now.   I am also considering retiring from doing engineering work once I sell my business interest this year.  But then that just gets me to thinking that would be one less obstacle to HRT!  Thanks for the suggestion about switching to a lower dose, I may may try that next when when/if I have more side effects from my current program.

Ohhhhh, I see how this can become a slippery slope progressing deciding how far to go with HRT.  I restarted HRT again last week so I am slowing starting up again, probably what led me to finally post in this forum.

Cheers,

Darlene